Official Report 548KB pdf
Legal Aid and Advice and Assistance (Fees) (Miscellaneous Amendment) (Scotland) Regulations 2026 [Draft]
09:30
::Our second agenda item is consideration of a draft affirmative instrument. I welcome to the meeting Siobhian Brown, Minister for Victims and Community Safety, who is accompanied by the following Scottish Government officials: Ciaran McDonald, legal aid reform team leader, and Emma Thomson, lawyer, legal directorate. Thank you for attending this morning.
I refer members to papers 1 and 2, and I invite the minister to speak to the draft instrument.
::Good morning, committee, and thank you, convener.
I welcome the opportunity to speak to the draft Legal Aid and Advice and Assistance (Fees) (Miscellaneous Amendment) (Scotland) Regulations 2026. This Scottish statutory instrument forms part of the Scottish Government’s programme of legal aid reform, which aims to strengthen access to justice and ensure that the system remains fair and sustainable for those who need it most.
The instrument will increase solicitors’ fees and fixed payments for criminal, civil and children’s legal aid and advice and assistance by 13 per cent, commencing on 1 September 2026. Additionally, it makes further changes to legal aid, amending regulations laid last December, and meets a commitment given to the Delegated Powers and Law Reform Committee to make corrections and minor drafting and clarification changes to the Civil Legal Aid (Scotland) Regulations 2002 and the Advice and Assistance (Assistance by Way of Representation) (Scotland) Regulations 2003.
The SSI has been developed in close collaboration with the Law Society of Scotland and the Scottish Solicitors Bar Association, and I want to express my thanks for their valuable contributions to the negotiations. I would also like to extend my gratitude to the Scottish Legal Aid Board for its input on the technical and operational aspects of the fee increase.
The SSI provides a significant increase to solicitors’ fees, ensuring that legal aid professionals are better remunerated and supported and allowing them to continue to make a real difference to people’s lives. The 13 per cent increase in fees addresses the profession’s concerns and contributes positively to the retention of legal aid solicitors as it decreases the potential risk of their stopping legal aid work. That would have a detrimental impact on access to justice and solicitor availability, as the committee heard in evidence to its recent inquiry on civil legal assistance. Indeed, the Law Society of Scotland has publicly welcomed the increase, calling it
“a lifeline for access to justice”.
The SSI forms part of a broader package of reform that includes the establishment of an independent fee review mechanism group, which will help shape the future of legal aid by creating a robust, evidence-based process for reviewing and agreeing legal aid fees. The package also includes further secondary legislation that will come into force on 1 April, 1 June and 14 December this year, as approved by the committee on 3 February.
Additionally, funding for 40 traineeships with digital support for new trainees will be provided as part of the fee uplift package of reforms to further support access to justice. The package demonstrates the Scottish Government’s commitment to a long-term investment in the talent pipeline into the legal aid profession.
In summary, convener, the fee uplift reaffirms our commitment to continuing to provide a robust legal aid system and supporting solicitors to provide crucial legal aid services, which, in turn, allow people access to justice whenever they might need it. We aim to ensure that people get the help that they need and that the solicitors are there to provide it.
I am happy to take questions.
::Thank you. We will move on to questions from Maggie Chapman.
::Good morning, minister. I am sorry that I cannot join you in person, but I thank you for that update. The 13 per cent uplift is welcome news. I have a couple of questions about that and on-going work.
I am interested in the 13 per cent figure that was arrived at. It was about 15 months ago that we discussed court fees for individuals to pay. There were some much higher increases in those fees, and one of the arguments was about full cost recovery. One of the things that came through clearly in our legal aid inquiry was that legal aid was not paying its way for solicitors. What assurances can the minister give that the 13 per cent increase will be enough to allow legal aid solicitors to cover their costs fully and to ensure that it is fair compensation for the vital work that they do?
::There has been a long period of negotiations with the Law Society and the Scottish Solicitors Bar Association about this uplift during the past 12 months, and that is how we came to the 13 per cent figure. As you know, action was being undertaken, which ceased in December. That is the figure that we have negotiated and, as I said in my opening speech, the Law Society said that it will be a lifeline for the profession.
On top of that, the fee review mechanism group that was established had its first meeting in December last year. That is an important group that had been asked for for many years, and it means that fees can now be reviewed annually, which was important to the profession. With the 13 per cent increase and the fee review mechanism group having been set up, I am confident that we are on a stable footing moving forward.
::Thank you. That is helpful. Given the conversations that can happen and the annual reviews, I am curious about why the 13 per cent increase will apply from September this year and how it will impact on potential future increases, given the work of the fee review mechanism group.
::Through some of the reform that we have been doing in secondary legislation, uplifts will be coming in on 1 April, 1 June and 14 December. The 1 September date for the introduction of the 13 per cent uplift has been negotiated with the profession. SLAB and the profession will have operational aspects to put in place, so it is not something that can be done overnight. We have had discussions with the profession and it is happy for the uplift to be introduced on 1 September.
::Last night, we received the updated timeline for the different activities in legal aid reform, and I put my thanks for that on the record. I know that a lot of work is being done in this space and, although we do not yet have the legislation for legal aid reform, it is helpful to see the other elements that are going on laid out in your correspondence.
I will leave it there, convener. Thank you.
::We now have questions from Paul McLennan.
::It is great to hear about the progress of the discussions as we look towards the next parliamentary session. The committee made some recommendations on civil legal assistance and you have also talked about that in the chamber, minister. Does anything else need to be done in what we have left of the current parliamentary session? What do you see as the medium and longer-term objectives when the Parliament comes back in the new session?
::I apologise for my letter coming late last night. It has a lot of detail in it and I am not aware of whether all the committee members have been able to go through it. I have been able to outline some of the work that I have been doing to get secondary legislation through during the current parliamentary session and, as we look ahead to the next parliamentary session, it will be up to the next Government to take that work forward. I think that it will include developing new primary legislation to modernise the legal aid framework, with the aim of introducing a clearer and more flexible system and supporting longer-term reform.
On top of that—I can guarantee that this will happen, because it was introduced by this Scottish Government—we have the implementation of the provisions of the Regulation of Legal Services (Scotland) Bill, which was passed last year. That will include the phased commencement of licensed provider provisions, which will support the delivery of the legal aid traineeship fund by the Law Society of Scotland to support long-term workforce resilience alongside on-going evaluation to strengthen legal aid.
::I have a supplementary question. The minister will remember that I have asked this in the chamber as well. It is about accessibility in more remote areas. Will you touch on that? You gave me an answer in the chamber, but it would be useful for the committee if you could say a little more about equality of accessibility for those in remote areas.
::Absolutely. As we move into the next parliamentary session and consider primary legislation for legal aid reform, it is really important that all the recommendations from the committee’s civil legal aid report are taken into account for the next Scottish Government to move forward.
::Thank you.
::Before I ask my main question, I want to ask the minister about the 40 traineeships that she mentioned. Those are definitely to be welcomed, so thank you for that. Will you require any of the trainees who have qualified to give back X number of years, so that, once they are qualified, they focus on legal aid rather than going into other types of law?
::Originally, it was to be 20 traineeships, which as a result of the negotiations has now gone up to 40 traineeships along with the digital support package. We are continuing to discuss with the Law Society the terms and conditions of that.
I will bring in Ciaran McDonald to talk about whether that point has been raised by the profession.
We are still negotiating and talking about it, so we will be looking into the detail of that, and we will be able to share that with you in due course.
::So, that is Government funded, and there might be some requirement that those people spend time on legal aid cases.
::Yes.
::My next question is on something that my colleague Paul McLennan touched on, which is longer-term legal aid reform. It is difficult to say, because this is for the next parliamentary session, but have you stressed the point that reform is long overdue and needs to be looked at quickly?
::Yes. We went through that when we discussed the issue in a previous meeting. The work that I have been doing in the past 18 months is outlined in the letter that was sent to committee members yesterday. A lot of work has been done. Moving forward, there will be primary legislation from the next Scottish Government although, as we know, that does not happen quickly. However, in the meantime, I am still having discussions with the Scottish Legal Aid Board about priorities for things that can be done through secondary legislation in the next parliamentary session. Those conversations are on-going and aim to maximise the reform that we can do before we do the primary legislation. I hope that that gives you some comfort.
::When we had the debate on legal aid in the chamber, we discussed the issue of women fleeing domestic abuse and the recommendation that the financial thresholds be removed. On the Scottish Legal Aid Board—or SLAB, which is an unfortunate word—there was heavy criticism of it and the bureaucracy involved. Have you addressed that issue with SLAB since we raised it in our debate?
::Yes. I have on-going conversations with SLAB—I met with it last week. We must be clear that the work that SLAB does is vital. We have a legal aid budget of £170 million and SLAB plays a huge role in legal aid reform. As I said in the previous committee session when we discussed the issue, there is an acknowledgement that, when we are doing legal aid reform, it will include parts of SLAB, and it is totally open to that.
::Perfect—thank you.
::What other things are happening to help to provide legal advice in rural areas? Obviously, increases in fees help, but there are many other issues, such as the distance travelled and how people access the advice. Are you looking at any other measures?
::The negotiations that we have been having for the past couple of months have primarily been on fee uplifts, to ensure that solicitors get the fees that come in in September. We hope that that will attract more people into doing legal aid work across Scotland, which of course will be beneficial for and impact on rural areas. In that previous committee meeting, you referred to perhaps having a group to focus on rural legal aid in the next parliamentary session. If I am the minister, I would be happy to pursue that and consider how we can make improvements to legal aid in rural areas.
::Thank you.
09:45
::We move to agenda item 3, which is the formal consideration of motion S6M-20605. I invite the minister to move the motion.
Motion moved,
That the Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee recommends that the Legal Aid and Advice and Assistance (Fees) (Miscellaneous Amendment) (Scotland) Regulations 2026 [draft] be approved.—[Siobhian Brown]
Motion agreed to.
::Do members agree to delegate to me approval of the publication of a short factual report on our deliberations on the affirmative instrument that we have considered today?
Members indicated agreement.
::That concludes this agenda item. I thank the minister and officials for their attendance.
Upper Tribunal for Scotland (Procedure Rules) (Miscellaneous Amendment) Regulations 2026 (SSI 2026/33)
First-tier Tribunal for Scotland (Procedure Rules) (Miscellaneous Amendment) Regulations 2026 (SSI 2026/34)
Mental Health Tribunal for Scotland (Practice and Procedure) (No 2) Amendment Rules 2026 (SSI 2026/35)
::Our next item of business is consideration of three negative Scottish statutory instruments. As no member has indicated that they have comments, are members content not to make any comments to the Parliament on any of the instruments?
Members indicated agreement.
::That concludes consideration of the instruments. We will suspend briefly to set up for our next agenda item.
09:47
Meeting suspended.
09:57
On resuming—
International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights
::Welcome back. Our fourth agenda item is to take evidence on Scotland-specific issues raised in the concluding observations and recommendations of the United Nations Committee on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights. The Scottish Government published its high-level action plan in November 2025, setting out how it intends to respond to those recommendations.
I welcome Kaukab Stewart, Minister for Equalities, who is accompanied by Elli Kontorravdis, head of human rights implementation and international policy, and Kevin McGowan, unit head of the equality division, both from the Scottish Government. They are all very welcome and I thank them for attending today.
I refer members to papers 4 and 5 and invite the minister to make an opening statement.
::I am grateful for the opportunity to provide an update on the steps that this Government has taken to respond to the concluding observations that were made in February by the United Nations Committee on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights. I last appeared before the committee on this topic in May 2025 and corresponded with you in November, when I was able to provide you with further detail.
In November, the Scottish Government published a high-level action plan that directly responds to each of the UN committee’s recommendations relating to devolved matters. Civil society and expert voices shaped our approach, which moves away from earlier narrative position statements and now focuses squarely on the actions that we are taking across a wide range of economic, social and cultural rights. The high-level action plan reaffirms our commitment to more deeply embedding treaty obligations in our policy and practice, and provides a practical framework to support collaboration, accountability, and scrutiny.
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It is important to remember that, since the last state party review in 2016, we have faced major global and domestic challenges, including our European Union exit, the Covid-19 pandemic, the on-going impacts of the war in Ukraine, a rising cost of living and increasingly divisive rhetoric affecting community cohesion. Those pressures have underscored the need to place human rights—especially economic, social and cultural rights—at the centre of policy and practice. Scotland’s most recent programme for government reflects that, as it sets out our ambitious actions to advance our four priorities: eradicating child poverty, growing the economy, tackling the climate emergency and delivering high-quality, sustainable public services.
In its evidence session in February 2025, the UN committee welcomed Scotland’s distinct approach to human rights, particularly our proposal for a human rights bill that incorporates ICESCR into domestic law within devolved competence, which will build on the Parliament’s leadership in the incorporation of the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child. The UN committee also recognised our public health-led strategy on alcohol and drug harms, which the Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Human Rights has acknowledged as the first of its kind in the world.
However, we know that we must do more. Therefore, our high-level action plan sets out what we are doing and will do across a wide range of devolved areas, including fair work, social security, child poverty, housing, education and cultural rights. That work sits within our wider ambition to foster a rights-respecting culture in Scotland and increasingly embed human rights across the Government through our national performance framework, which is supported by Scotland’s second national human rights action plan and the recently published equality and human rights mainstreaming strategy, toolkit and action plan.
The publication of that high-level action plan marks a significant milestone in our wider programme to strengthen the implementation of international treaty body recommendations as part of a wider approach to human rights in Scotland. As I updated you in May, another important element of that work is the development of a new human rights tracker. The tracker will consolidate treaty body recommendations into a single, accessible online platform. It will support us all to identify and act on international recommendations in a strategic and co-ordinated way, which will help to enhance our rights implementation efforts in devolved areas.
The first phase of the work will provide a centralised and transparent record of the recommendations that arise from the seven core UN treaties to which the UK is a signatory. In time, and subject to the outcome of the Scottish Parliament elections, I intend to continue to work with stakeholders to develop a methodology to clearly and consistently report on actions that are taken and on outcomes. The tool, which was a key SNAP2 recommendation, aims to support an increasingly systematic monitoring of progress, to help identify any gaps and areas for improvement and to strengthen accountability for action on devolved matters. That was a key SNAP2 recommendation and I look forward to seeing it launched in this parliamentary session.
I am pleased to now confirm that the first phase of the tracker will go live on 12 March and I have extended an invitation to you via the committee clerks for the launch event and demonstration. I am grateful to them for their time as members of the tracker design group in recognition that such tools can support greater parliamentary scrutiny.
In parallel with our domestic implementation agenda, I have also had the pleasure of showcasing our distinct approach to human rights in various engagements with international human rights specialists over the past couple of months. In November, the Cabinet Secretary for Social Justice and I met Michael O’Flaherty, the Commissioner for Human Rights at the Council of Europe. We used the opportunity to highlight our human rights approach to social security and the action that we are taking to eradicate child poverty, as well as reaffirming Scotland’s support for the European convention on human rights. The commissioner recognised the value of our work on the incorporation of international human rights treaties and we expect to see a memo following his visit later.
Also in November, at the 30United Nations climate change conference of the parties—COP30—the Scottish Government announced a grant of £150,000 in support of the mandate of the UN special rapporteur on human rights and climate change. Through the grant, Scotland is not only contributing to global discourse but helping to enable inclusive rights-based responses to the climate crisis.
Last month, at an event hosted by the organisation Art27 Scotland, the Parliament welcomed to Scotland Alexandra Xanthaki—forgive my pronunciation of her name—who is the UN special rapporteur on cultural rights. As the former Minister for Culture, Europe and International Development, I was particularly pleased to have the opportunity to emphasise that cultural rights are not just a nice-to-have; they are inherent rights that we want to give greater protection to through our proposals for a human rights bill.
I understand that today’s evidence session will focus specifically on the high-level action plan in response to the UN committee’s recommendations, and I welcome this opportunity. I remain committed to working together to strengthen good practice in implementation, reporting and follow-up to international human rights treaty bodies.
::We move to questions from members, and I will kick us off. What specific progress has been made on the human rights bill?
::We continue to make good progress on further developing and refining our human rights bill proposals. Our goal is to introduce an ambitious and effective bill that brings positive change. In July last year, we were pleased to publish the detailed discussion paper on our proposals for the bill. That paper consolidates the extensive work that has been undertaken to date, and we are supporting further engagement with stakeholders.
We continue to test and refine the proposals and to work through the implications for further incorporation legislation, building on lessons from the Human Rights Act 1998 and the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (Incorporation) (Scotland) Act 2024. As the committee is aware, the UK Supreme Court 2021 judgment on the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (Incorporation) (Scotland) Bill and the European Charter of Local Self-Government (Incorporation) (Scotland) Bill has implications for the potential scope of the proposed duties under the human rights bill, and we continue to use this time to chart a way forward on that. The committee has been kept informed on the work that we have undertaken to develop the proposals, and we will continue to provide updates to the relevant committees following the 2026 election.
It is worth noting that, when the Cabinet Secretary for Social Justice and I met the Council of Europe’s Commissioner on Human Rights, the commissioner described our incorporation agenda as an impressive body of work that will also be of interest to the Office of the United Nations High Commissioner for Human Rights.
::Rhoda Grant has a supplementary question.
::What are the specific non-devolved and devolved issues that are causing concern, and how do you expect to overcome them?
::I will bring in Elli Kontorravdis on that. First, as an overview, I note that, in bringing so many treaties together—some of them for the first time—we are leading the way and being ambitious. They sit together with all the different reserved and devolved powers, as well as the European convention on human rights, and we are navigating all those spaces that have different rules, regulations and scopes. To bring those all together, we have to work systemically and systematically to ensure that whatever we have actually has an impact on people’s lives. I always try to remember that that is the bigger aim. It is not a paperwork exercise or a challenge in that sense; the challenge is how effective the system will be and whether all the legislation sits together. Perhaps I can bring in Elli on further details of the compatibilities.
As the minister noted, we are continuing to engage with the UK Government on the challenges that have resulted from the interpretation of the Supreme Court judgment. I welcome the recent publication from the University of Glasgow’s centre for public policy that reports on the issue, which makes clear that cross-Government co-operation and collaboration will be required to resolve it.
In her chairing of the human rights: incorporation and implementation oversight board, the minister has noted that the legislation is complex. We are working with stakeholders to work through that complexity and make sure that the bill is able to be delivered and is effective and impactful on the ground.
In addition to the matter of the scope of the UNCRC, another area of consideration is the group protection treaties. It is about making sure that the duties that are applied will be workable and consistent with the Equality Act 2010.
::What does that mean in practice? Where are the difficulties, and how easy are they to overcome? Do we need to be granted devolved responsibility in some areas, or are there areas of the bill that should be cut out because they will infringe on non-devolved issues? Where does all that fall?
::I can give an example that is based on what we are already doing. We are listening carefully to feedback relating to the challenges that resulted from the UNCRC compatibility duty and the concerns that were raised about the exemption to the compatibility duty during the recent parliamentary passage of the Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment of UNCRC Compatibility Duty) (Scotland) Bill. That feedback will inform our consideration of the scope of the proposed duties in the human rights bill.
The bill will provide us with an opportunity to consider the alternative options that—as you suggested—may be available to ensure the best possible breadth of duties while still meeting the central aim of having a clear, accessible and navigable framework within devolved competence.
I hope that that answer is helpful. The issue is complex, and there is no easy answer. I wish that I could give you a one-line answer, but there is not one to give, because this issue demonstrates the complexities of how everything sits together. However, I can give you the assurance that all that work is being worked through at a detailed level with extensive engagement with stakeholders and experts in this space.
::Thank you.
::Good morning, minister. Thank you for joining us and for what you have said so far. I have a couple of questions on how you intend to use the high-level action plan. I recognise that the plan is high level from the get-go. However, some significant and problematic areas of concern, including food security and a housing crisis that is denying people access to safe, affordable and adequate housing, were raised in the Scottish Human Rights Commission’s “State of the Nation” report, which was published last year. Given those areas of concern, how will the high-level action plan help you to deliver the outcomes that you were talking about and make things better for people across Scotland?
There is a concern that, although there are a lot of fine words in the action plan, it is not clear how they will be translated into action on the ground. I am particularly interested in housing and homelessness, but there are issues across the board that relate to poverty and food inequality. I would be interested to hear your comments on that.
::Thank you for acknowledging the complexities and how wide ranging the issue is, given that it is cross-portfolio, cross-Governmental and cross-legislation.
The high-level action plan is the first of its kind in the UK. I draw your attention to the word “action” and I acknowledge that nobody just wants warm words, which is why I emphasise that word. The plan sets out systematically what we are doing to strengthen the implementation of rights in the areas that were raised by the UN committee, including some of those that you have mentioned, as well as fair work, social security, child poverty, educational and cultural rights and, of course, housing.
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We acknowledge that human rights are interrelated and interdependent. The high-level action plan presents the strategic and co-ordinated actions that we will take across economic, social and cultural rights, although we will need to unpack that further in the relevant strategies and deliverable plans that are associated with those issues.
There are many areas to consider, but as Ms Chapman has raised housing, I can give a bit more detail on that, if it will be helpful. On housing access and affordability, the plan states a rights-based housing commitment that includes an expansion of the affordable housing supply, with the intention of setting up a new housing agency with a focus on simplicity, scale and speed to enable the delivery of housing of all types. It also includes the prevention and reduction of homelessness through on-going investment to prevent homelessness and rough sleeping, including £15 billion in 2025-26 for councils to support a range of services, including homelessness prevention, and targeted support to address housing inequalities for priority groups, including the coming home programme, for example, and improved outcomes for Gypsy Traveller communities through the Gypsy Traveller accommodation fund.
I can go into other areas if Ms Chapman wishes it.
::No, but thank you, that is helpful. We could go into a lot of areas in quite a lot of detail. You talked about the need for cross-governmental support, and we are talking not just about the Scottish Government but about local government and the whole Scotland picture. The committee has already had a conversation about the concern that has been raised about the other agencies that will be required to be able to act to support, whether that is in housing and homelessness prevention or preventing child poverty wherever we look. I am curious about your thinking around the on-going sustainability of funds such as the equalities and human rights fund that provide crucial support to organisations that work and are embedded in communities across Scotland and that see phenomenal returns on investment, but are seeing the pot dwindle. I suppose that is easiest way of putting it.
::I understand what you are asking. That exemplifies how wide ranging the plan is and that so many people are involved in its delivery, which supports our view that we need to take time to work through it so that we end up with something that will make sure that people can realise their rights. People can have rights but, as the committee has said previously, they must be able to realise those rights.
That is where we need extensive engagement. We have to take people with us not only through awareness raising but through the capacity and capability building that has been going on throughout. I have talked to the committee previously about embedding a human rights approach in everything that we do.
One example is the mainstreaming toolkit, and we must ensure that, in undertaking this work, we do not take away from that culture of embedding human rights in the first place. Of course, that is not a new concept, and we are all working towards the same goal in that respect.
Your question went further than that, I suppose, in recognising the third sector’s essential and valued work in delivering that support to people and communities. I assure you that it plays a very strategic role in enabling that transformation and the delivery of person-centred services.
On the issue of funding, it was announced in the draft budget for 2026-27 that the Scottish Government will invest £14.2 million in third sector infrastructure and development. Latest estimates indicate that, across Government, we invested over £1 billion in the sector in 2023.
If Ms Chapman is asking me about the sustainability of that as we progress our work on human rights, I would just say that multiyear funding is always asked for, and we recognise that longer-term planning allows for sustainability and security of development. Therefore, we are delivering against our commitment to develop a fairer funding approach by providing more multiyear funding to third sector organisations that deliver those front-line services and are tackling child poverty. Indeed, in the 2025-26 programme for government, we committed to delivering a fairer funding pilot to provide more of that multiyear funding to third sector organisations, prioritising those that, as I have said, deliver front-line services and which tackle child poverty. That pilot consists of 51 Government grants for third sector organisations totalling over £130 million over the period from 2025-26 to 2026-27.
I hope that that helps.
::That was helpful, but certain questions are being raised with us as we talk about this issue. There are groups or organisations that are working in communities across Scotland and have built relationships in those communities; indeed, what they do might well be trusted more than local authority or national Government projects or programmes.
One challenge is understanding that, just because something has been around for a long time, that does not mean that it needs to be replaced with something innovative, and another is recognising that the relationships that are built between local organisations and the communities that they support cannot be easily replicated. Once they go, they take a long time to rebuild, and there is concern that the current approach taken by the equality and human rights fund—I will mention it again later—will result in programmes and projects closing, because they cannot be sustained, and that people will have to start from scratch in building those relationships as well as the trust on which a lot of this equalities and human rights work relies.
You gave a lot of information in your previous answer, but I would like some acknowledgement from the Scottish Government that this is about not just the multiplicity of funds and multiyear funding but the sustainability of existing funding. That is really important, too.
::I totally acknowledge that. As you will be well aware, the equality and human rights fund supports highly valued projects that are tackling some of the most systemic discrimination and prejudice, and some of the projects that have been funded have a specific focus on community relations, which you referred to. The Scottish Government has provided £36 million—the actual number is £36,843,807—between 2021 and 2026.
One example of our acceptance of the need for sustainable, multiyear funding is the commitment to provide multiyear funding to disabled people’s organisations. That has been funded through the EHRF and will be subject to the proposed bill being passed, but I hope that that example of our commitment shows that we are making progress in that area.
::I appreciate that, but I think that those who run the EHRF would say that they have actually seen a 25 per cent cut, because its flat cash budget has not reflected inflationary uplifts over the past five years.
I will move to my next issue. In your opening comments, you spoke about the significant pressures that we face and mentioned divisive rhetoric. I am interested in knowing what actions the Scottish Government will take—other than through the anti-racism in education programme—to ensure that we are tackling the racist and anti-immigration behaviour that we see on our streets right now.
::I believe that the Scottish Government took a strong leadership role in response to the concerning scenes and rhetoric that we saw especially over the summer. We did that to ensure that we acknowledge the hard work that goes on at grass-roots level to bring communities together. We have strong, cohesive communities and there has been good work over the years, but we have realised that that can be quite fragile, so we want to invest in and protect that.
I secured additional funding of about £300,000, which was specifically targeted at grass-roots community organisations. To ensure that that money did not get caught up in administrative matters, we partnered with the STV children’s appeal, which already has structures for that sort of work. When I was up in Dundee just last week, I saw the impact of that funding in bringing communities together in safe spaces where people can talk about their real and legitimate concerns, including the continuing cost of living crisis and access to services to meet their day-to-day needs. I also know that some organisations have invested in training staff to have de-escalation conversations or to deal with misinformation and disinformation at community level, so that we are reaching the people who are having those conversations.
::I am sorry to interrupt you, but I want to focus on misinformation and disinformation, which you spoke about. In Dundee and Aberdeen, I have witnessed people being directly targeted on the streets because of their skin colour or ethnicity. However, because those incidents have happened at so-called protests, Police Scotland officers who have witnessed them have done nothing about them.
One of my concerns is that you have a high-level action plan and you have arrangements in place, including the community cohesion funding that you were just talking about, but we need all public sector bodies, including Police Scotland and other agencies, to act. I am concerned that there is no real understanding of where protest becomes criminal behaviour, including hate speech, inciting hatred and even blatant racism, and that we are not seeing our public agencies acting to de-escalate there and then. I am really concerned that the conversation does not seem to capture that and that we are therefore not enabling people to express their social and economic rights.
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::I fully acknowledge your concerns. We have seen some absolutely appalling scenes. Although I would always uphold the right to legitimate, peaceful protest, there is absolutely no place for the incitement of any kind of hatred towards any kind of group.
::When that happens, what do you expect Police Scotland to do?
::I will bring in Elli Kontorravdis on the human rights tracker tool, because I think that where you are going with that question is about how we track such things and how all the different organisations will be enabled to fulfil their obligations. If Elli can speak about the human rights tracker tool, that might be helpful.
I will speak to the system-level actions that Maggie Chapman asked about. I reiterate what the minister said—in March, the Scottish Government will publish the 2026 to 2030 anti-racism delivery plan to accelerate targeted system-level actions. A priority in that plan is embedding anti-racism across Government through strengthened governance, shared accountability and improved data, which are the themes that the minister has connected with the human rights tracker tool.
As the minister said, that tool will be launched on 12 March. It will enable us to all have the ability to take more strategic and co-ordinated action and to really join the dots between the different repeat issues that come up, not only under the treaty that we are looking at today but across international human rights treaties—for example, the treaty that the Committee on the Elimination of Racial Discrimination deals with is covered in the tracker. In time, we will be able to monitor actions and outcomes that relate to the recommendations that come from such treaty bodies.
::I appreciate that the tool is coming in March, but that is not much comfort to the people who, week after week, are exposed to racist hate speech and see no action happen. It is deeply concerning that we are not seeing the action to back up all the rhetoric about there being no place for racism on our streets. I will leave it there, convener.
::We will move to Rhoda Grant, please.
::Beyond what is already in the high-level action plan, what actions is the Scottish Government taking to tackle violence against women?
::I am sorry—will you repeat that? I did not hear. I am hard of hearing; forgive me.
::I am softly spoken, which is probably not helping you. I asked about the additional actions that the Scottish Government is taking to tackle violence against women, beyond what is in the high-level action plan.
::I will link things together. We are absolutely committed to meeting the benchmark that international treaties and obligations such as the Istanbul convention have set. The final report from the Group of Experts on Action against Violence against Women and Domestic Violence, also known as GREVIO, gave us an insight into and key recommendations on how the Scottish Government is complying with the obligations that arise from the Istanbul convention. The report consisted of 90 recommendations, many of which are UK-wide, with some directed at individual nations, and you will be aware that they cover many areas including health, education, the no recourse to public funds condition, data collection and the criminal justice system.
Our equally safe delivery plan contains an action to respond to the GREVIO reporting process, as well as a commitment to develop an action plan in relation to how we will implement the Istanbul convention’s recommendations—I think that it is action 13.2 of the plan. We are working with internal and external partners in a concerned and comprehensive way to develop the GREVIO action plan. Ahead of the election period, we intend to set out our plans for the next phase of implementing the GREVIO recommendations, including the key actions in the priority areas.
::The Scottish Government recognises that prostitution is violence against women, but it voted down what was known as the unbuyable bill—the Prostitution (Offences and Support) (Scotland) Bill—partly because of the costs associated with providing support for women in prostitution and routes out of it. Surely, if the Scottish Government already recognises that this constitutes violence against women, it must provide support and routes out, regardless of whether that is in legislation.
::I do not have the equally safe delivery plan in front of me, but from what I recall, it contains specific actions that are related to that. I will bring in Kevin McGowan to respond.
Around 115 projects delivered by 107 organisations are funded through the delivering equally safe fund, and they support 67,000 adults, children and young people, some of whom are vulnerable women. On your specific question about supporting women through routes out of prostitution, we can come back to you with more definitive figures, if that would help.
::That would be helpful. Thank you.
::We move on to questions from Tess White.
::Good morning. What steps will be taken to improve the availability of intersectional and disaggregated data, given the quite significant gaps identified by civil society organisations and the Scottish Human Rights Commission?
::We absolutely recognise and accept the challenges, but overall, we have seen good progress towards the aims of “Scotland’s Equality Evidence Strategy 2023-2025”. It is really important to get that evidence and, over the lifetime of that strategy, we have seen an increase in the availability of equality and intersectional data across a wide range of policy areas, including Social Security Scotland, transport, health, social care and education.
We have improved the accessibility of that equality evidence through updates to our equality evidence finder, the publication of our 2023 gender equality index and the production of a number of detailed quantitative and qualitative reports examining the lived experience of people across Scotland, including non-binary people and minority ethnic groups. We have shared that work alongside other examples of good practice in collecting, analysing and producing equality evidence both internally and externally. An evaluation of the strategy is under way and is due to be published in the spring, and it will provide an assessment of improvements to the equality evidence base and identify areas for improvement to be taken forward in the next strategy.
We are not complacent. It is important to recognise the progress that we have made, but I absolutely accept that we have much further to go.
::At the start of this evidence session, you talked about the four priorities, and I noted that one of those key goals, which drive all of the actions, is delivering high-quality, sustainable public services. The fact is that data and its recording matter; you mentioned non-binary people and the gender equality index, but when we look at four of the nine protected characteristics under the Equality Act 2010—age, disability, sex and race—you might argue that the characteristics that people are most discriminated against on are age and disability.
There has been a decrease in even the most basic public services, such as loos, libraries and leisure centres. There is still a urinary leash; in fact, the number of local toilets and changing places has massively decreased, which is causing issues in rural areas. There has been a 16 per cent decrease in the number of libraries, which provide a safe space for people to go to where they can access information technology; they also provide warmth for people who need it during the day. The massive decrease in libraries was raised with the Cabinet Secretary for Constitution, External Affairs and Culture last week. Risk assessments for leisure centres are not taking place against the protected characteristics of age, disability, sex and even race. You are looking at and collecting data on things that are not protected characteristics under the Equality Act 2010. If you cannot get the base data, how can you build and create positive outcomes?
::I do not understand your question about collecting data on characteristics that are not protected, because race is a protected characteristic.
::If the public sector was collecting data on four core protected characteristics—age, disability, sex and race—you would not be facing what you term “systemic discrimination”. We have just spoken about race, and you could say that race and religion are characteristics to address, which Maggie Chapman raised. I am adding age, disability and sex to that list. There is a massive disconnect with what the Scottish Government is measuring and reporting on, because being non-binary is not a protected characteristic, and neither is gender. You cannot manage what you do not measure.
Why do you not go back to the nine protected characteristics to look at age, disability, sex and race on an intersectional basis and at the basic services that you are providing? Last week, the committee published a report on the huge issues related to rural discrimination. You just have to look at maternity services in the Highlands and in the northern end of Scotland to see that women are being discriminated against in those areas. We are also not providing public sector loos, which discriminates against disabled people.
Both women with disabilities and women of a certain age are being discriminated against, but the Scottish Government is not collecting the data and is not requiring local government to do so. How can you measure positive outcomes if you are not even looking at the basic data?
::Data is collected; it is incorrect to say that it is not. With reference to intersectionalities, which we have spoken about before, different protected characteristics intersect, which causes additional layers of discrimination, depending on the characteristics. For instance, if someone is from an ethnic minority and is a disabled person, that creates additional layers of discrimination. Although those aspects come under separate protected characteristics, they will inevitably intersect.
I will give you an example. You talked about gathering evidence and data on disabled people. In January, we published a comprehensive and intersectional evidence review of disabled people’s experiences in Scotland, delivering key actions from our disability equality plan. The review was a difficult read. There were things that set out the stark reality and the intersectional barriers that disabled people face, particularly if they are from the LGBT community or an ethnic minority. All those factors add layers.
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For the Government, it was really helpful to bring together all that evidence, which will be central to informing future policies. Ultimately, as we have talked about before, the need for data is not only about the numbers. We must consider how data will affect policy and people’s outcomes and improve their life chances. The evidence will inform our future policies and priorities as we seek to improve disabled people’s lives. The publication of the evidence also supports our wider commitment to strengthen the use of the equality and intersectional evidence from public and corporate policy design, monitoring and evaluation.
You are quite right—it is great that you have taken the issue down to a community level by mentioning the things that you have. From what I remember, we have expanded the changing places toilets Scotland fund. There have been huge investments in that area, which have been welcomed. Specific outcomes result from such investments.
Are we collecting the data? Yes, we are. Is it important? Yes, it is. Does it affect our policy decisions? Yes, it does. Our aim is to improve lives. To bring the discussion back to the human rights bill, it will bring all those aspects together and strengthen people’s rights while laying the groundwork for the implementation of future human rights. Everybody has the right to be able to access a toilet—of course they do. The bill will enable that to happen. Funding comes with that commitment—for the Improvement Service and NHS Education for Scotland—in order to strengthen everybody’s knowledge and understanding.
Forgive me if I went off track a bit.
::To address the most basic point, there is a cross-party group on changing places, and very little progress has been made on the issue. I acknowledge that there is a fund, but the number of toilets and changing places is decreasing in local areas—there is only one in the north-east, in Dundee station, and there is not one on the rest of the line. It means that if you are a 75-year-old woman who has dementia, for example, you cannot leave your home, because nowhere has such facilities. The reality is that if you are stuck at Laurencekirk station, there is no loo.
The feedback is that there is a huge disconnect when it comes to basic intersectional data on protected characteristics, and if you overlay what the Scottish Human Rights Commission has shared with us—it is in our report—you can see that data is not being collected on age, disability, sex or race. If you overlay rurality on to that, you can see that there is a massive issue.
Do you recognise that the basic data is not being collected across Scotland on those four protected characteristics, and that if you overlay rurality, it is definitely not being collected?
::No, I would not go as far as that. You put your question in such stark terms, but the answer is not straightforward. I believe that we are collecting that data, although I acknowledge that there are complexities in bringing it together. We have talked before about the fact that the numbers are sometimes very small, and they have to be statistically viable, so there are challenges there.
The equality evidence finder is a very useful tool—I will perhaps bring in Kevin McGowan to drill down into the technical detail.
::Before Kevin comes in, I want to point out that I have made freedom of information requests of 160 public sector organisations. Many of them cannot even define sex; they collect data on gender. Some of them could not give me an answer on what actions they have taken on the nine protected characteristics. One of them even said, “What do you mean by action?” My point is that the Scottish Government and 160 public sector organisations are not collecting basic data on those different protected characteristics. How can you measure outcomes if you are not collecting the base data?
I have all the FOI responses and I am very happy to share them with you. You would be shocked to see that they have come back saying that they are not collecting the data on the nine protected characteristics. Many of them cannot even define the difference between sex and gender, and they do not know what an action is.
::The human rights bill will enable everybody's rights to be realised and focus everybody’s minds on ensuring that. There is also the public sector equality duty. I would remind all organisations that they have a duty to collect appropriate data to feed into that policy. We have to ask what the aim is, why we are collecting the data and what we are trying to achieve. We need to make sure that we collect data that is appropriate and fit for purpose. That is what I expect. As I said, the equality evidence finder might help to provide the committee with more information.
::I will move on. Maybe we can take the conversation offline. Would you meet with me so that I can share with you the evidence that demonstrates that the public sector organisations are not collecting that data? You can have all sorts of finders and reports, but you are not collecting the base data. If you meet with me, I will share that evidence with you.
::Ms White, I am always delighted to meet with any colleague and with any member of this committee.
::Apologies for my technical issues this morning. Minister, I do not know whether you answered this when I was offline, but a key issue that was raised in the recommendations related to tackling the institutionalisation of people with learning disabilities. There are many areas within that. Will you say a bit more about that?
You mentioned the high-level action plan and how we monitor it. My second question is about how we monitor and report back on it. Will you say a bit more about how you see this committee holding the Government to account on that?
::I picked up most of that question. Was your first question regarding people with learning disabilities?
::Yes.
::Thank you. I did not quite catch the second bit, but maybe you could come back in with a wee reminder for me.
I previously mentioned the coming home agenda. I just want to reiterate that the Scottish Government is committed to the coming home agenda. We accept that it is completely unacceptable that people are spending time in hospitals or other care settings when they are medically fit for discharge. We know that, for every unnecessary day they spend in hospital, people lose a part of their connection with their community, their family and their friends.
The Scottish Government has provided over £20 million of funding to integration authorities through the community living change fund, as well as other funding. That has had a real impact on support for people to move into the community. We are doing a final review of the impact of that funding, as we want to make sure that it is having the impact that we want it to have.
The Scottish Government and COSLA jointly established a coming home senior strategy group to oversee the implementation of the coming home implementation report. It delivered the dynamic support register, which was launched in May 2023 and which improves the visibility of people with learning disabilities and complex care needs at local and national levels. It also provides a tool to support local planning decision making. The most recent quarterly dynamic support register data, which took us up to September 2025, shows that fewer people were delayed in hospital or in inappropriate placings out of area compared with last year. The register has had an impact.
There is also a peer support network that brings together learning disability professionals from across Scotland to share best practice and to get support with planning services for individuals with particularly complex needs. There is also initial thinking on a national support panel to improve support and accountability and to hear from families and individuals about their individual circumstances.
The consultation on the learning disabilities, autism and neurodivergence bill set out the three options around the scope and remit of the panel, and further work has taken place to develop those options. I can provide further information on that.
I would be grateful for a reminder of the second part of your question.
::I do not know whether I am having connection problems—my apologies.
The second part of my question is about monitoring and reports on the high-level action plan. You talked about monitoring, but I am asking about the reporting back. The key thing for me is that the actions go across a number of portfolios, so the question is how they are reported. We will get reports back, but how do you intend to look at actions to ensure that they are taken across all portfolios and not just this one? The high-level action plan obviously impacts on other portfolios, as well. Could I have your thoughts on that, if that is okay?
::Obviously, the ultimate aim is that the content of the high-level action plan is integrated into the forthcoming human rights tracker, which will in time support us to report on those actions and outcomes to both domestic and international committees.
As I said in my opening remarks, I will launch the tracker on 12 March. We have given an invitation to the clerks, which I think is being taken up, but it would be very helpful for committee members to look at the tracker, so that you can get a practical insight into what it looks like, what it feels like and how effective it is.
The intent of that tool is to help improve transparency and to enhance the implementation efforts on the recommendations that we receive from the human rights treaty bodies. The first phase of that is an accessible database of recommendations with the aim of further enabling us all to take strategic and co-ordinated action in devolved areas. Our intention is that the national human rights institutions, the Scottish Parliament, civil society and the rights holders will be better able, via the tracker, to review the recommendations and, ultimately, scrutinise the actions taken and the outcomes achieved.
As I have said, this committee plays a critical role in human rights scrutiny, so I encourage members to attend the launch and have a look at the tracker.
::Good morning. Do you want to say anything else on human rights budgeting? Are you aware of any additional work that the Scottish Government is doing to ensure that future budgets comply with the international covenant?
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::The Cabinet Secretary for Finance and Local Government and I were here very recently, and we spoke extensively to the committee about the improvements to the budget process. The use of human rights budgeting principles remains part of that process. We have made continuous progress in recent years and we are exploring how best to make more ambitious changes in future years, while being mindful of ICESCR and the equality obligations.
One of the main additions to the strategic integrated impact assessment, or SIIA, has been to integrate the detailed assessment of child rights and wellbeing under the requirements of the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child, as incorporated into Scots law.
Our detailed analysis concluded that the substantial investment in the child poverty package and the spending that benefits all children is likely to be positive for child rights, in particular the right to an adequate standard of living, the right to the highest attainable standard of healthcare and the right to an education.
The Scottish Parliament information centre noted in its blog that this approach
“may give an indication as to the opportunities which may arise should the Government achieve its intention to further embed human and social rights”
in Scots law. That is an acknowledgement that we are absolutely moving in the right direction.
The evidence on how portfolios contribute to human rights was collected as part of that SIIA process, but, in the interests of developing a streamlined and more accessible document, we decided not to publish that. It is all about actions. How valuable are the documents that we published alongside the budget process? How accessible are they? Which ones are used most meaningfully?
The pilot work that we have done on budget tagging may provide opportunities to support human rights budgeting in the future. Our planned evaluation of the work that we have done for the budget will help us to understand better what might be the best ways to take things further. I have already committed to sharing that work with the committee, as always.
I hope that that is helpful.
::Yes. You have spoken about the importance of embedding a human rights approach into and across the public sector. What resources will be required to achieve that kind of cultural change?
::That is indeed about resources, but cultural change is about mindset. We start with the premise that human rights are for everybody and that, by the very virtue of being a human, you are entitled to those basic rights. We need to keep that aim in mind, whatever else we do on top of that. To back that up, we need to take people with us, ensuring that they have plenty of time for that development of understanding.
A lot of good work has gone on in that respect. I have already mentioned to the committee the mainstreaming work that I have undertaken this past year. We launched the mainstreaming suite of resources on 8 December 2025. It includes a strategy, a groundbreaking toolkit and the action plan. Together, the mainstreaming suite lays the best conditions to embed a human rights culture.
I believe that the strategy provides a clear vision and framework for changing how we develop policies, deliver services and allocate resources. On a technical level, the action plan brought together 61 of our actions, which align to the six key drivers that are outlined in the strategy. It also focuses on Scottish Government actions. It brings together all the different resources in a way that makes them accessible and comprehensive.
I cannot give you exact examples of the resources, because more than 100 are available. However, it is about capacity building and evolving. As we discover more resources that are helpful, we will add those to the bank of resources. Doing so lays out the best possible conditions to ensure that we are all committed to moving forward on a human rights agenda.
::I agree with you that it is not all down to budgets; it is about changing mindsets. It could be a policy change that brings about the change that is required.
::That brings this agenda item to a close. I thank the minister and her officials once again for joining us. We will suspend briefly for a changeover of witnesses.
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Meeting suspended.
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On resuming—
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