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All Official Reports of meetings in the Debating Chamber of the Scottish Parliament.
All Official Reports of public meetings of committees.
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Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee
Meeting date: 9 March 2022
Finlay Carson
Okay. Cabinet secretary, I thank you and your officials for staying with us for this extended period. We really appreciate it. As you can understand, there are a lot of questions to be asked.
Agenda item 2 relates to motion S6M-03543, in the name of Rachael Hamilton, which asks the committee to agree to recommend that the instrument be annulled.
I invite Rachael Hamilton to set out her reasons for lodging the motion. The cabinet secretary will have an opportunity to comment and can bring in her officials as necessary. We will debate the motion formally at item 3.
Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee
Meeting date: 9 March 2022
Finlay Carson
As no member of the committee wishes to ask Rachael Hamilton any questions, I turn to the cabinet secretary.
Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee
Meeting date: 9 March 2022
Finlay Carson
As the cabinet secretary has admitted, the process has been flawed from the start, and I believe that it is still flawed at the finish. The unprecedented numbers of responses about the first order that was laid, and the subsequent very short timescale before the second order was laid, are of concern, and there is a lack of transparency over what factors contributed to the orders being changed. We have heard of concerns about scientific evidence, data collection and monitoring, a lack of appreciation of the impact of the closures on socioeconomic aspects and environmental safety, and proportionality. One fisherman suggested that the comment about a short-term economic impact on local fishers showed an “almost flippant attitude”.
I have concerns that, given the new Bute house agreement, this will not be the last order of this type that we see in front of us. On that basis, there needs to be some recognition that, along with other sectors, whether that is oil and gas, transport or farming, a transition to a more sustainable way of fishing needs to be compensated for or supported in some way. There is a complete lack of appreciation of the impact on fishers as they try to do the best thing, which is to create sustainable fisheries. On that basis, I will support the motion to annul.
11:15Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee
Meeting date: 9 March 2022
Finlay Carson
On that point, I presume that, if the instrument was to be annulled, the Government would need to lay another instrument. Are you suggesting that, if the instrument was to be annulled, you would walk away from protecting cod altogether?
Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee
Meeting date: 9 March 2022
Finlay Carson
I have no comment to make on that.
We will move on. The question is, that motion S6M-03543, in the name of Rachael Hamilton, be agreed to. Are we agreed?
Members: No.
Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee
Meeting date: 9 March 2022
Finlay Carson
I now bring in Jackie Baillie.
Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee
Meeting date: 9 March 2022
Finlay Carson
Dr Needle, would you like to come back in? You were cut off in your prime.
Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee
Meeting date: 9 March 2022
Finlay Carson
Rachael Hamilton has a supplementary question.
Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee
Meeting date: 9 March 2022
Finlay Carson
On that line of questioning, one cod can produce between a million and 2 million eggs, and you need only two of those eggs to survive to adulthood in order to sustain the population. Is the impact of noise or the potential impact of a hand diver or creels in any way significant with regard to sustainability? We heard that the fish still generally spawn—the issue is the mortality after the eggs have hatched. Is disturbance of any significance at all to spawning?
Rural Affairs, Islands and Natural Environment Committee
Meeting date: 9 March 2022
Finlay Carson
Cabinet secretary, you told us that the measure might increase stocks. Rachael Hamilton was referring to the fishermen that are currently in the Clyde. Are you talking about an increased stock of scallops or prawns? You said that there would be a benefit from an increase in stock. How will that benefit Clyde fishermen?