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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 13 September 2025
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Displaying 1631 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

Tackling Digital Exclusion

Meeting date: 5 September 2024

Jamie Greene

Is that not part of the problem, Auditor General? The language that you use in the report and which you have repeated in your opening statement is relatively harsh in its analysis. You say that

“leadership ... has weakened”,

that

“momentum has ... slowed”

and that there is a lack of an action plan and a lack of lines of responsibility. These are common themes that we on the committee hear arising from a wide range of public services and from Government management and oversight of them. Do those things come as a surprise to you? Is there a feeling that it is perhaps not that the Government has taken its eye off the ball, due to pressures on public finances, but that its eye was never on the ball in the first place? I am trying to get a feel for whether the direction of travel is towards a worsening situation or whether the strategy was never there in the first place.

09:30  

Public Audit Committee

Tackling Digital Exclusion

Meeting date: 5 September 2024

Jamie Greene

That is great news. I was really taken aback by the statistic that one in six Scots lack foundation-level digital skills—not advanced digital skills, but basic digital skills. How does that compare with other parts of Europe and the United Kingdom? Are we faring well, or is that the world average at the moment?

Public Audit Committee

Tackling Digital Exclusion

Meeting date: 5 September 2024

Jamie Greene

I might come back in with other questions later.

Meeting of the Commission

Audit Scotland Annual Report and Accounts for the Year to 31 March 2024

Meeting date: 24 June 2024

Jamie Greene

Probably not that long.

Meeting of the Commission

Audit Scotland Annual Report and Accounts for the Year to 31 March 2024

Meeting date: 24 June 2024

Jamie Greene

That is great, and it is good news. That leads me sideways into another question, which is about your ways of working. The paragraph on that in the annual report is relatively short and does not really say much. We have had a lot of conversation about your high rent costs across your three offices, yet, post pandemic, you seem to be operating a much more hybrid model. Is there no way that you could reduce running costs rather than see them go up? They should surely be coming down.

Meeting of the Commission

Audit Scotland Annual Report and Accounts for the Year to 31 March 2024

Meeting date: 24 June 2024

Jamie Greene

I believe that you were here, David, for the earlier evidence session, so you will have followed that line of questioning. At any point when you were looking at the accounts, did any of the issues that we identified in relation to where there was quite large variance in the accounts raise questions?

I will refer to two examples that might help you come to an answer on this. The travel and subsistence budget went from £500,000 to the reported figure in the accounts of only £82,000, which raises the question of whether there was just a change in the way that things are reported—that is, whether the line that such things appear in has changed due to changes in accounting practices—or whether there has been a huge reduction in the forecast figure versus the used.

The depreciation figure almost doubled from £500,000 to £1 million. Did those things raise flags as you went through the accounts, and were there any conversations around them?

Meeting of the Commission

Audit Scotland Annual Report and Accounts for the Year to 31 March 2024

Meeting date: 24 June 2024

Jamie Greene

Are you generally content with the rationale and explanations that have been given, including what you have heard this morning?

Meeting of the Commission

Audit Scotland Annual Report and Accounts for the Year to 31 March 2024

Meeting date: 24 June 2024

Jamie Greene

It is just that there is a variance of 15 per cent between what was approved at budget and what was spent, which is stark. I guess that I was trying to get under the skin of why the costs went up so much. I wondered whether some of the external firms charged higher rates or different multiples, such as double or triple time, in order to get work finished. I am a little further forward in understanding the 15 per cent figure, but I still do not fully understand it.

Meeting of the Commission

Audit Scotland Annual Report and Accounts for the Year to 31 March 2024

Meeting date: 24 June 2024

Jamie Greene

We look forward to seeing those savings on the balance sheet in due course.

My substantive question—I am sorry that I got sidetracked with some other questions, convener—is a specific one about the amount of money that is being paid in fees to external firms. That has increased considerably from just over £7 million to £8.1 million. Your annual report seems to suggest that that increase of more than £1 million is due to a lag in the completion of audits, if I interpret that correctly. You can correct me if I am wrong about that. However, the amount of audits that have been completed has marginally reduced by a couple of percentage points, so it does not seem to quite add up. Perhaps you could enlighten us as to why there has been such an increase in the amount of money that is being paid to external companies.

Meeting of the Commission

Audit Scotland Annual Report and Accounts for the Year to 31 March 2024

Meeting date: 24 June 2024

Jamie Greene

I have a few supplementary questions resulting from that conversation before I move into my main line of questioning.

I should say good morning. I know that it is a Monday morning, but we will get through this together.

Following on from the staffing issue, I want to look at staffing costs and pay rises, in particular. I have just spotted year-on-year changes on page 48 of your 2023-24 annual report and accounts, under your fair pay disclosure arrangements. This is backed up by looking at the table. It seems to me that the average year-on-year increase for employees is around 5 per cent—I presume that that is a general inflationary measure that you have introduced—but the increase is much higher for the higher earners in the organisation. In particular, the highest-paid individual received an 8 per cent increase. Is there any particular reason for that?