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Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 2 February 2026
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Displaying 1955 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

“NHS in Scotland: Spotlight on governance”

Meeting date: 24 September 2025

Jamie Greene

I think that you would find it very enlightening. We talked about that subject in great detail, and committee members raised the point that people jumping from one board to another could be seen as a revolving door, a reward for failure or the result of having a cosy club of chief executives who move on to another board for more money and leave others in the lurch.

Public Audit Committee

“NHS in Scotland: Spotlight on governance”

Meeting date: 24 September 2025

Jamie Greene

It sounds as though there is a bit of movement of professionals within the Scottish health service or the health and social care arena who will go from an IJB to an executive role within an NHS board, from one board to another, or from a management position on a board into a non-exec position on a board. Again, I can see why there may be benefits to that. People will have experience and knowledge of how things are done in other areas. However, equally, does that perhaps point to some problematic areas? People have perhaps failed in one part of the service and are moving to another, or is the predicament that we do not have enough new blood coming from outside Scotland into the Scottish health service?

Public Audit Committee

“NHS in Scotland: Spotlight on governance”

Meeting date: 24 September 2025

Jamie Greene

We also heard a lot in the previous session about some of the struggles that some of our more rural boards have in recruiting people. Indeed, the convener gave an excellent example of one board where some of the board members do not live in, or had never been to, the board area. Clearly, it is more difficult in a wide range of public bodies to recruit in more rural and Highlands and island areas, but how important is it that these people have local knowledge and understanding of the complexities of delivering health services outside the central belt?

Public Audit Committee

“NHS in Scotland: Spotlight on governance”

Meeting date: 24 September 2025

Jamie Greene

Good. I think that I know what your answer will be to this, but are we struggling to get so many candidates to fill these board positions because there are simply too many boards?

Public Audit Committee

“NHS in Scotland: Spotlight on governance”

Meeting date: 24 September 2025

Jamie Greene

Thank you very much.

Public Audit Committee

“NHS in Scotland: Spotlight on governance”

Meeting date: 24 September 2025

Jamie Greene

Do you report on those? Are they a matter of public record?

Public Audit Committee

“NHS in Scotland: Spotlight on governance”

Meeting date: 24 September 2025

Jamie Greene

If you have an NHS board that has financial governance issues and is in the red, or has performance or operational issues—if, for example, it is not meeting any of its clinical targets or has high turnover or other issues of governance—do you have to wait on someone complaining to you before there is an investigation into that board? To me, there are clearly situations where the board has a direct level of accountability for overseeing all of the above, and there are clearly failures in many of those areas—we look at them weekly.

Public Audit Committee

“NHS in Scotland: Spotlight on governance”

Meeting date: 24 September 2025

Jamie Greene

What due diligence takes place to ensure that people are not brought into a health board when the board that they have previously run—or been an integral part of running—has been underperforming operationally, clinically or financially? Are those the people you want in our health boards?

Public Audit Committee

“NHS in Scotland: Spotlight on governance”

Meeting date: 24 September 2025

Jamie Greene

Right. Has anyone who has run a board that has had such high-level escalation or intervention moved to another board?

Public Audit Committee

“NHS in Scotland: Spotlight on governance”

Meeting date: 24 September 2025

Jamie Greene

Yes, please check that and write to us.

We talked a little bit in the earlier session about the importance of the role of the non-executive board in holding the executive to account in any public body or organisation. If someone has been part and parcel of that organisation for a long period of time, although I can see that they may bring knowledge and experience of that sector to their non-exec role, are they simply too close to the system and the people involved in it to be able to hold them properly to account in terms of governance arrangements?