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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 15 October 2025
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Displaying 1245 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Prostitution (Offences and Support) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 October 2025

Liam Kerr

Good morning. I will direct my questions precisely, but catch my eye if you want to come in. I will come to Diane Martin first. The committee has received evidence that states that the criminalisation of those who buy sex would put sex workers at greater risk of violence and would not reduce demand for prostitution or reduce trafficking. Do you take a different view? If so, why?

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Prostitution (Offences and Support) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 October 2025

Liam Kerr

Yes, convener. I am very grateful to all the witnesses.

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Prostitution (Offences and Support) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 October 2025

Liam Kerr

Good morning. Niki Adams, I will come straight back to you. The committee has your evidence that the criminalisation of those who buy sex puts sex workers at greater risk of violence and does not reduce demand for prostitution or reduce trafficking. Panel 1 took a different view and talked about France, specifically, as an exemplar. Your evidence speaks to specific research in France that has a very different, negative take. Can you help the committee understand why there is a discrepancy on that point? Why is one panel of witnesses telling us that France is an exemplar, while you seem to be saying that it is not, and you conclude that criminalisation will not work?

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Prostitution (Offences and Support) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 October 2025

Liam Kerr

I am very grateful for that evidence.

I put a similar question to Laura Baillie. You also raise the subject of safety in your evidence, although your evidence says that criminalisation would mean that sex workers

“would be less able to screen potential clients”

and less able to get a deposit. You refer to an app that enables some form of screening.

The witnesses on panel 1 gave a different response to that—they seemed to suggest that screening and checking is not currently happening in practice. That is clearly different from what you say in your evidence. Can you help the committee to understand why there is that difference and tell us, in your view, what is actually happening on the ground?

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Prostitution (Offences and Support) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 October 2025

Liam Kerr

I will ask one tiny question on something that you just said, Lynsey Walton. You talked about millions of alerts going out to users. Given what we heard, how much power does the sex worker have to decline the transaction or instruction once they receive that alert?

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Prostitution (Offences and Support) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 October 2025

Liam Kerr

I am very grateful for your answer.

09:45  

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Prostitution (Offences and Support) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 October 2025

Liam Kerr

I put the same question to Bronagh Andrew. According to the bill’s policy memorandum, the measures are intended to “reduce the number” of people in prostitution. Is there any evidence that models such as the Nordic model achieve a reduction in the number of people in prostitution?

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Prostitution (Offences and Support) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 October 2025

Liam Kerr

Yes, and I want to take that forward. If you do not mind, I will stay with you for this question. You talked about the work that you have been doing jointly with Police Scotland. Last week, I read a report in the Daily Record that said that Police Scotland is supportive of criminalising the purchase of sex but “could not afford to enforce a crackdown”. Given that, to what extent does the effectiveness of a Nordic model hinge on enforcement by the police and courts, or is it more about messaging and driving a culture change?

Criminal Justice Committee [Draft]

Prostitution (Offences and Support) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 8 October 2025

Liam Kerr

I am very grateful. Lynsey, you heard Laura Baillie talking about the Irish experience. Your written evidence also refers to Ireland. You said that, in Northern Ireland, the Department of Justice found “no evidence” of

“a downward pressure on ... demand ... or supply”.

You also refer to a minister in the Republic of Ireland saying that “demand has not decreased.”

Towards the end of the evidence session, the first panel said that the bill is the only legislation that reduces prostitution. You cited the example of Ireland. What, if anything has happened to supply, not just the demand side? You said that only 15 men were convicted in seven years in the Republic, so is it actually a policing issue?

11:30  

Criminal Justice Committee (Draft)

Substance Misuse in Prisons

Meeting date: 24 September 2025

Liam Kerr

I will move on, but before I do so, I would just remark—because I think that we would all accept that there is overcrowding—that I was simply trying to establish what is being done to bring that overcrowding down. I certainly do not question the engagement that the cabinet secretary is having, but I think that people outside need to see real change.