The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.
All Official Reports of meetings in the Debating Chamber of the Scottish Parliament.
All Official Reports of public meetings of committees.
Displaying 1443 contributions
Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 9 October 2024
Jenny Gilruth
I might defer to officials on that. From a teacher’s perspective—taking off my cab sec hat—I do not see why we would be against that approach, in which the committee would seek to listen to the views of young people. I suppose the point that the member is making is that it should not be tokenistic: young people should be able to speak freely, but if they are in a room full of adults, they will not be able to do that.
Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 9 October 2024
Jenny Gilruth
I will bring in Jaxon on that point.
Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 9 October 2024
Jenny Gilruth
I do not think that my expectation is that they would sit as members. It goes back to the point that Mr Mason made about the role of qualifications Scotland staff being largely administrative, responding to challenge and listening to and understanding the views of members. If Mr Greer’s view is that we need to stipulate that in primary legislation, we can look at that. That feels quite specific, but I take the point that he is making.
When we are talking about the credibility of the organisation, we need to be mindful that the structures have to introduce a level of challenge that has arguably been lacking in recent times. I do not want to see them stacked with the staff who work in that organisation. That is not the purpose of those structures. They are there to provide a different view and a different role, and to provide challenge.
I am not sure whether we would stipulate that in the primary legislation, but there might be something that we could do around guidance. I might defer to officials on that point. Again, I am pretty sympathetic to Mr Greer’s point.
Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 9 October 2024
Jenny Gilruth
Absolutely. I take Mr Greer’s point that the 49 per cent suggestion would fly in the face of the purpose of the legislation.
Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 9 October 2024
Jenny Gilruth
Which stakeholders would Mr Greer envisage that we should stipulate? I hear him saying that we should not stipulate, but there are many broader stakeholders in Scottish education. I do not want to close the door to that wider engagement, but we need to be careful that we are not being overly specific about some of this.
Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 9 October 2024
Jenny Gilruth
I will bring in Jaxon on that point.
Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 9 October 2024
Jenny Gilruth
The member makes a fair point, so we will take that away and reflect on how we could strengthen the approach, although I would be worried about specifying. We will look again at how we can strengthen some of the wording around our expectations on consultation so that it is meaningful.
Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 9 October 2024
Jenny Gilruth
Part of that is for the Government, but it is partly about co-creation, too. The approach that we are taking is not about the Government dictating things, but about our stakeholders saying, “This is how ambitious we want to be, and this is where we want to go.” There was a lot of support for the charters in the consultation, particularly around the role of children and young people, but some concerns were raised about their potentially becoming a token gesture, and we might come on to talk about that.
We must have better transparency; that is the real purpose of the charters, and it is something that has probably been a challenge for the organisation in recent history. Therefore, the charters have to be co-designed with the groups whom they are intended to serve, and I think that that will answer the call for ambition, as all user groups need to be content with the co-design approach. It is not me, as cabinet secretary, who will decide the level of ambition—I think that that would be quite wrong. Instead, it is for those groups to come together and set their own aspirations. I imagine that they will be very ambitious, and we will have to respond to that.
Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 9 October 2024
Jenny Gilruth
No, not necessarily. I go back to the point that I made to the member at the start of this evidence session: if there are specific parts of the bill that the member thinks are deficient in some way, I am happy to work with her on looking at how we can strengthen them.
I have to come back to my original point, though, which is that the status quo is not working. We have to get this right. We have to reform the qualifications body, because I cannot deliver on the aspirations of Professor Hayward’s review unless we do this work. The body has to listen to the views of teachers and young people. It has not been able to fulfil those expectations in recent history, so how we reform and change it is really important.
Look, I am a politician, and I am quite sure that we will all disagree on parts of the bill, but there will also be areas on which we can make progress. However, if the member thinks that this area needs strengthening, I will be happy to hear any of her views further to that.
10:30Education, Children and Young People Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 9 October 2024
Jenny Gilruth
The member makes what sounds like a reasonable point. Again, I will defer to my officials.