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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 1 May 2025
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Displaying 880 contributions

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Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Ferry Services Inquiry

Meeting date: 28 February 2023

Jenny Gilruth

Obviously, CMAL will look at mitigation in that regard. There is a solution for the small vessel fleet, which relates to batteries, but it is true that there are more challenges with larger vessels. We now have LNG for vessels 801 and 802. I think that Jim Anderson described that as a transition fuel. We need to think about how we will provide, in the future, cleaner ferries that meet our net zero aspirations. That applies particularly to larger vessels, because the technology for them is just not there yet. We need to keep pace with the technology. That goes back to the point that Ms Lennon made about experts. We need to engage with experts and academics to ensure that we are abreast of all the latest developments and that CMAL has the relevant data to ensure that the design spec keeps pace with those developments.

My officials might want to say more about the specifics.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Ferry Services Inquiry

Meeting date: 28 February 2023

Jenny Gilruth

I very much recognise the challenge to the Government there. The existing arrangements are historical—they have been in place for a number of years, as Ms Lennon will know. The Government will need to look at that, although I have not been presented with any suggestions on how we might change that arrangement at the current time. However, that is something that we will need to consider.

I have recently heard from other members on that point. That is a convention that has existed historically, but we will need to look at that in the longer term.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Ferry Services Inquiry

Meeting date: 28 February 2023

Jenny Gilruth

It is important that we have trade union representation. Having Roz Foyer on the SRH board brings a strength to our relationship with trade unions but also to the delivery of the service model. Therefore, absolutely, it is a model that we should look to roll out across more of our public bodies, because direct engagement and representation are really important.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Ferry Services Inquiry

Meeting date: 28 February 2023

Jenny Gilruth

Absolutely. The committee’s inquiry is really important and I am keen that we use it and the recommendations that you will provide us with to inform the draft ICP, CHFS3 and where we get to on project Neptune. I very much welcome it.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Ferry Services Inquiry

Meeting date: 28 February 2023

Jenny Gilruth

I am happy to provide the committee with that.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Ferry Services Inquiry

Meeting date: 28 February 2023

Jenny Gilruth

Yes, there is. I think that we have a couple of examples of where that has happened in recent times.

Both operators—today we are talking a lot about CalMac, but we must not forget Serco NorthLink—have mechanisms in place for prioritising medical appointments, which is really important. The point that Mr Ruskell makes about last-minute journeys is not lost on me. It is consistently raised with me when I go out and speak to island communities. It is worth pointing out that CalMac has—in very recent times, actually—agreed to some changes to the criteria for short-notice medical appointments, which I know has been welcomed by island communities.

Transport Scotland might want to say more on this, but it has been working very closely in the past couple of weeks with the Mull & Iona Ferry Committee to look at a potential pilot on vehicle deck space for islanders who are travelling at short notice. It is fair to say that that work is at a pretty early stage but, from what I am told, it has been broadly welcomed by the Mull & Iona Ferry Committee. Officials might want to say more on that.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 28 February 2023

Jenny Gilruth

I was not asked for comment on the story, so I am glad that I have now got that on the record.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Ferry Services Inquiry

Meeting date: 28 February 2023

Jenny Gilruth

Unbundling is not an option that is favoured by the Scottish Government. I think that that decision was reached in 2014, although Chris Wilcock will correct me if I am wrong. At that time, a decision was made that unbundling would not be the approach that we would take.

Ultimately, if I thought that unbundling would be a silver bullet, it would be on the table. I am not sure that it is. In my job, I hear different things from communities on a daily basis, and it is not clear to me that unbundling would work, given the variety of routes and vessels that we have in CalMac.

It is important that we concentrate on delivering a better service across the network. That is certainly the decision that was taken historically in relation to unbundling. It could also be a distraction from the focus on improving resilience and reliability. We will not be reopening that question as part of project Neptune. I know and understand that people have different views on it, but it is not something that the Scottish Government will be considering at the current time.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Ferry Services Inquiry

Meeting date: 28 February 2023

Jenny Gilruth

Good morning, convener, and thank you for the opportunity to speak with committee members this morning. I welcome the committee’s inquiry very much and, to that end, I thank it for this morning’s opportunity.

I spend a great deal of my time as transport minister engaging with our island communities. Most recently, I was in Islay during recess speaking to local stakeholders about project Neptune. I am sure that we will hear more about that during the course of today’s committee meeting. That consultation is well under way and is being led by Angus Campbell.

To my mind, the committee’s inquiry is extremely timely. I am keen to hear from members today about their views on areas for improvement in relation to how we deliver ferry services in Scotland. I reflect that a substantial body of evidence already exists in relation to the topic. We have the REC Committee report from last session, the Audit Scotland report from March of last year, the pending Public Audit Committee report, and project Neptune, on which I provided an update to Parliament back in September. I very much welcome the committee’s inquiry, but I also know that we need to ensure that these recommendations are implemented at pace and that we have concrete solutions for improvements that are backed, of course, by our island communities.

The challenges that have been faced in relation to the CalMac fleet, particularly in recent times, will be well known to committee members. Island communities deserve better than the service that they have been experiencing in recent times. I am alive to that.

It is worth reflecting—as I think that the committee heard in some evidence from CMAL in the previous session—that weather is impacting on sailings in a way that it has never done in previous years. For example, in January and February of last year, just over 92 per cent of all cancellations were due to either weather or Covid-19. Indeed, last January and February weather accounted for 10 per cent of all cancellations

Those impacts are one of the reasons why I announced additional Scottish Government investment to give weather monitoring equipment to third-party ports. As the committee heard from CMAL, that should result in more reliable forecasting and less disruption.

I also announced last year that Transport Scotland is developing performance indicators that will be distinct from contractual targets, to better reflect the real experience of passengers. However, none of that detracts from the fact that we need to bring about greater resilience in the CalMac fleet, which is exactly why, in the past 12 months, I have accelerated investment into the fleet. In the past six months, CMAL made offers to purchase two second-hand major vessels—the MV Arrow and the MV Straitsman. Unfortunately, those offers were unsuccessful. Securing additional second-hand tonnage is difficult in a competitive market. It remains challenging, but commercial discussions remain on-going.

It is worth saying that, by the end of this session of Parliament in 2026, on top of the MV Loch Frisa, we expect to have delivered six new major vessels, and we expect the small vessel replacement programme to be well under way.

Secondly, as I mentioned, community engagement on project Neptune, led by Angus Campbell, is already under way. Finally, I was pleased to publish an advance draft of our long-term plan for vessels and ports at the end of last year, as a first, and significant, element of the islands connectivity plan.

I put on record my thanks to the committee for the significant effort that it has made in engaging constructively with our island communities. It has been really helpful to hear some of the feedback. I know that the committee has been to Arran, Orkney and islands in the Outer Hebrides—I, too have visited those areas recently.

Clearly, we now have to reform how ferry services are delivered in Scotland, but with the guiding principle that our island communities have to be part of what comes next. I look forward to the committee’s report and to responding to the outcomes of the inquiry. My officials and I will be happy to take questions.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Ferry Services Inquiry

Meeting date: 28 February 2023

Jenny Gilruth

I ask Laurence to come in if he would like to do so.