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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 24 January 2026
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Displaying 1601 contributions

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SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 20 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

Thank you—that was very helpful. Excuse me for interrupting you with that point of clarity.

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 20 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

Okay.

I have a final set of questions for the witnesses. Is there anything that you wanted to say today that our questioning has not allowed you to emphasise to us? Also, as a final way of sharing your insights and knowledge, which have been extremely helpful, if you were in our shoes—if you were tasked with what we have been asked to do by Parliament—is there anything that you would definitely do? Alison, that is for you first.

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

It is very helpful—thank you. This committee has been tasked with looking at the SPCB funded bodies, but it is important for us to look at that in the wider context of the landscape of public bodies in Scotland. It is good to have you here today, given your wide remit, although I appreciate what you said about the Accounts Commission. That is an important and interesting clarification and point of emphasis, because one could ask why there is a divide between what you audit and what the Accounts Commission audits. Have you ever considered why everything does not sit with you, as the Auditor General?

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

That is interesting. We have both engaged with organisations such as the Scottish Commission on Social Security—SCOSS—so there are bodies that fulfil some aspects of that function. However, your argument is that there should be a comprehensive approach.

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

As the former Minister for Social Security and Local Government, I am very aware of that. It is helpful of you to set it all out for our evidence and as part of the discussion on the wider landscape, so I thank you for detailing the legacy and the nuance. Much of the scenario that the committee is considering relates to the position that has built up through legacy; we will get into more of that shortly.

In your written submission, interestingly, you categorise SPCB bodies as “less complex” in relation to audits. Can you comment further on how Audit Scotland ensures that the audit process for those less complex bodies is proportionate to their size and their complexity?

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

That is helpful, and it dovetails into my next question. In some of the committee’s previous evidence sessions, office holders highlighted that, in some instances, recommendations that were provided to smaller organisations were not tailored to the specific organisations. I would be grateful if you could clarify further what measures are in place to ensure that the recommendations that are provided during audits are sufficiently specific to, and actionable for, smaller organisations.

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

Auditor General, you have provided us with a lot of information, insights, context and clarifications this morning that will be really helpful to our task in this review. Is there anything else that you want to say that you have not been able to express in answer to the questions that we have posed?

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

Good morning, everyone, and welcome to the sixth meeting in 2025 of the SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee. I have received no apologies.

Today, the committee will take evidence from the Auditor General for Scotland, and then from MSPs who have proposals for bills that would create new Scottish Parliamentary Corporate Body supported bodies. I am pleased to welcome Stephen Boyle, the Auditor General for Scotland.

Auditor General, in the past few weeks, an emerging theme of the committee’s work has been the number of public bodies. We know what the role of each body is, and we know how people can get an understanding of that. In an evidence session that we had with the Scottish Information Commissioner a few weeks ago, he referred to the number of public bodies and to the discussions that he had had with you about that. Do you want to touch on that first, and feed back anything that you wish to say to us and to the Parliament in that regard?

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

You talked mostly about older people, but you also mentioned the Children and Young People’s Commissioner. Sarah Boyack has a proposal for the unborn and future generations. Do you want to answer my question, Sarah?

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review Committee [Draft]

SPCB Supported Bodies Landscape Review

Meeting date: 13 March 2025

Ben Macpherson

I am sorry to interrupt you when you are in full flow, but it is important to note that there are a number of Government-funded commissioners in organisations. Part of the challenge that we face is that there are the SPCB supported commissioners and there are commissioners such as the Police Investigations and Review Commissioner, which is funded by the Scottish Government but is seen as being independent. Although we have been tasked with considering only the SPCB-funded bodies, we are conscious of the wider picture. I feel that it is important to emphasise that, for context.