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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 19 January 2026
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Displaying 1221 contributions

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Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

Good morning, and welcome to the 36th meeting in 2025 of the Economy and Fair Work Committee. We are holding our final stage 1 evidence session on the Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill. We have received apologies from our colleague Murdo Fraser.

I welcome to the meeting Richard Lochhead, the Minister for Business and Employment, and his officials from the Scottish Government: Kieran Burke, bill team leader; Liam Hepburn, senior policy official; Fraser Gough, parliamentary counsel; and Emma Phillips, who is from the legal directorate.

I invite the minister to make a short opening statement.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

I am tempted to ask Mr Gough more questions about the karmic nature of the law, but I will resist that temptation.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

With that, I bring in my colleague Sarah Boyack.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

I have a brief supplementary to that. Professor Robbie made a point about whether carbon credits should be specifically carved out in the bill. Her point was that, once you have created something as property, it makes it very difficult for the Government to exercise control, because of the nature of property rights.

I am certainly not expecting an answer this morning, but I would like to know whether the Government is reflecting on that specific point about carbon credits, given that it was raised by Professor Robbie.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

My question was not really about whether we need to do that; that need is relatively clear, for exactly the reasons that you set out. My question was more about why the bill uses the term “rivalrous” rather than using language such as “exclusive control”. Was there a particular reason for using that novel term, which is certainly not in common usage, as opposed to using a slightly longer-form but plainer-language definition to cover the point that it belongs to one person who controls what happens to it?

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

Any Buddhist principles have been underexplored by the committee. I will ask a couple of additional questions, one of which draws on Kevin Stewart’s line of questioning. The bill simply establishes that digital assets are property under Scots law. I wonder whether one of the dangers is perhaps that we think about the big concepts, such as big corporate transactions or the future of technology, but are there considerations on that?

The legislation might well end up being important for things such as civil disputes, probate and divorce settlements. Should some considerations be made because of the nature of digital assets, which are different? For example, it is more possible for someone to say that they have lost access to a digital asset, such as an access key or what have you. In a divorce case going through the courts, you can imagine scenarios in which people might try to claim that they do not have the assets that it is claimed they have because they have lost the ability to access their digital assets and all their wealth.

I am not asking that specific question, but is there a need to examine any safeguards, procedures or technicalities in relation to the application of civil disputes, probate and divorce settlements, or other things that we think of as the nuts and bolts of Scots law and civil law, if the subject of those proceedings will be digital assets?

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

Finally—again—I recognise that the bill is unusual. It is focused and short, but some of the concepts that it deals with are expansive. Before we close the meeting, I invite the minister to say whether there are any issues or items that he wants to note that we have perhaps not touched on in the questions that we have asked.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

Thank you. With that, I will bring in the deputy convener, Michelle Thomson.

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

Similarly, there is also the concept of immutability. We heard from Professor Fox that the bill may not require absolute immutability. In the most fundamental sense, we are talking about virtual things that exist as electrons in hard disk memory banks and in a distributed way, so they are not, therefore, in an absolute sense, immutable at all.

Is it problematic that we are talking about hard immutability, either physically or conceptually? Professor Fox said that absolute immutability may not be required—as a practical approach, if these things are operating as they should be, they are unchangeable. Is the problem that there is a fuzzy margin in the concept of immutability with regard to the bill?

Economy and Fair Work Committee [Draft]

Digital Assets (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 December 2025

Daniel Johnson

Thank you very much, minister. What are your and your team’s reflections on that evidence? To summarise the evidence, there has been broad agreement that we must incorporate digital assets into Scots law. The framing of the bill has received broad support, but there have been questions, in broad terms, about the clarity, and what may or may not be captured at the margins, of the definitions. I note that that is not necessarily a universal view.

Those are some of the points that have been raised. What are your broad reflections on the evidence that the committee has heard?