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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 7 May 2025
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Displaying 3076 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of the Scottish Government Consolidated Accounts”

Meeting date: 7 November 2024

Richard Leonard

Graham Simpson has been able to join us, and I will bring him in in a moment to ask the final few questions. Before I do that, I turn to the final section of the section 22 report, which is headed “Performance reporting”. It starts off with your usual diplomatic tone, Auditor General, when you say:

“The complicated landscape of priorities is hindering the achievement of outcomes”.

However, when we go on to look at paragraphs 66 and 67, you are a bit harder hitting. You say:

“There is an absence of clearly defined performance measures with measurable targets for all priority areas.”

You also say that

“It is unacceptable that six indicators for the previous NPF remain in development.”

That is quite a stiff judgment. What are the reasons that the Scottish Government gives for those deficiencies?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of the Scottish Government Consolidated Accounts”

Meeting date: 7 November 2024

Richard Leonard

As I mentioned earlier, we may well invite the Scottish Government to give evidence to us on the consolidated accounts, because we would be keen to get a bit more detail from it about the area that you just mentioned, as well as about what its plans are.

I will move on to expenses associated with litigation. In previous years, the committee has taken an interest in the payments that have had to be made to former directors of Rangers Football Club: £60 million-worth of unplanned spend—as it is called—were paid out from the Crown Office and Procurator Fiscal Service, and the settlements left a large hole in the accounts.

This year, the payment that you have highlighted is considerably less than that—I think that it is £0.34 million, with provision for a further £7 million. Where are we in the trajectory of those cases and those settlements? Have they all been, or almost been, settled? Do you expect any further claims?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of the Scottish Government Consolidated Accounts”

Meeting date: 7 November 2024

Richard Leonard

We have had a long and detailed session. There are areas that we would ask you to clarify for us, Auditor General, and it is pretty clear that there are some outstanding questions that we should direct not at you but at the Scottish Government, so we will have to consider how we can best do that.

Thank you very much, Auditor General, Helen Russell and Carole Grant, for your willingness to give us such comprehensive evidence this morning. It is greatly appreciated.

I close the public part of the session and move the committee into private session.

10:58 Meeting continued in private until 11:24.  

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of the Scottish Government Consolidated Accounts”

Meeting date: 7 November 2024

Richard Leonard

Item 3 is consideration of the 2023-24 audit of the Scottish Government’s consolidated accounts. I am pleased to welcome the Auditor General for Scotland, Stephen Boyle. He is joined by Carole Grant, who is audit director, and Helen Russell, who is senior audit manager, at Audit Scotland.

Auditor General, we have quite a number of questions to put to you this morning. However, before we get to those, I invite you to make a short opening statement.

Public Audit Committee

Tackling Digital Exclusion

Meeting date: 31 October 2024

Richard Leonard

Are you saying that you accept that finding or that you do not accept it?

Public Audit Committee

Tackling Digital Exclusion

Meeting date: 31 October 2024

Richard Leonard

So do you now have detailed actions? Have you designated who is responsible for them? Do you have timescales and monitoring arrangements?

Public Audit Committee

Tackling Digital Exclusion

Meeting date: 31 October 2024

Richard Leonard

Mr Huggins, you spoke earlier about “a major success story” but, on the subject of digital exclusion, I infer from what you said that you think that it is the ageing population that is digitally excluded and that, over time, that will diminish, as though you think that people are going to die off and the problem will go away. However, that is not what the report says, is it? It says that age is a factor—of course it is, and everybody understands that—but the introduction to the report says:

“Digital exclusion is strongly associated with poverty and people with certain protected characteristics.”

My question is for the director general. What is the Scottish Government’s position? Is it that you think that the problem will diminish over time because older people are going to die, or do you see that there is a real and present issue because of people’s impoverishment and protected characteristics, which will continue to exist and to be a challenge, and on which the Government needs to show some leadership?

Public Audit Committee

Tackling Digital Exclusion

Meeting date: 31 October 2024

Richard Leonard

Okay—thank you. I will bring in Colin Beattie next.

Public Audit Committee

Decision on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 31 October 2024

Richard Leonard

Good morning and welcome to the 26th meeting in 2024 of the Public Audit Committee. Our first agenda item is to consider whether to take items 3 and 4 in private. Is that agreed?

Members indicated agreement.

Public Audit Committee

Tackling Digital Exclusion

Meeting date: 31 October 2024

Richard Leonard

Our main item is a further consideration of the joint report by the Auditor General for Scotland and the Accounts Commission “Tackling digital exclusion”. I am pleased to welcome our witnesses: Lesley Fraser, director general corporate, Geoff Huggins, chief digital officer, and Eilidh McLaughlin, deputy director, digital ethics, inclusion and assurance—all at the Scottish Government; and Martyn Wallace, chief digital officer in the digital office for Scottish local government, Convention of Scottish Local Authorities.

There are no opening statements, so I will start the questions. I direct my first question to Lesley Fraser. Do you accept the findings and the recommendations in the Auditor General for Scotland and Accounts Commission report “Tackling digital exclusion”?