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All Official Reports of meetings in the Debating Chamber of the Scottish Parliament.
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Public Audit Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
Yes, but I do not think that any of us would accept that there was nothing to see here, Mr Watson.
Public Audit Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
That is not how the Auditor General viewed the situation when he gave evidence to us on 8 October, and we can return to that.
One of the things that have been reported is that, under your tenure as the principal and chief executive, there were five different finance directors. Why was that?
Public Audit Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
I will bring in Joe FitzPatrick in a second, but can I just take you back, Mr Watson, to some of the fundamentals here? When we took evidence from the Auditor General on 8 October, he said:
“I ... cannot recall, from my time in this role and during my career of auditing public bodies in Scotland, an organisation that has not prepared an annual budget.”
In your time—in your career—Mr Watson, have you ever been part of an organisation that has not prepared an annual budget?
Public Audit Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
We are talking about an organisation that is governed by the Public Finance and Accountability (Scotland) Act 2000 and is subject to the Scottish public finance manual. We are not talking about a private enterprise. We are talking about public money, which is why we expect certain standards to be met.
The Auditor General said:
“a budget gives an organisation an anchor with which to measure how it is progressing during the year.”
Margaret Cook, do you not accept that that is a fact?
Public Audit Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
This is my final question before I bring in other members of the committee.
I would be interested in your view on the Auditor General’s comment:
“we cannot help but conclude that that”
budget’s
“absence must have been a significant factor in the board of management being less able to control financial arrangements during that time.”—[Official Report, Public Audit Committee, 8 October 2025; c 5, 6, 2.]
You are shaking your head, Mr Wishart. I take it that you do not agree with that view.
Public Audit Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
Okay, but my point is that you have set aside your own financial regulations, both in your position and the position of the former principal and chief executive. I would also suggest that the people on the board have set aside their obligations under those financial regulations.
I will invite Joe FitzPatrick to come in on this budget question, before I invite Graham Simpson to ask his questions.
Public Audit Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
Thank you very much. Graham Simpson has some questions as well.
Public Audit Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
Mr Watson, would you be willing to give us a copy of that December 2024 letter and for it to be placed in the public domain? Also, did you write that letter on behalf of the whole board, or was it a personal letter?
Public Audit Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
Thank you. That is helpful.
Public Audit Committee [Draft]
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
You might not know it, but that has neatly teed up the deputy convener, who has questions on AST as well as broader questions, which I am sure that he will want to put not just to you, Mr Watson, but to Dr Cook and Mr Wishart.