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Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 19 July 2025
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Displaying 3298 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

“Scotland’s colleges 2023”

Meeting date: 30 November 2023

Richard Leonard

You are not negotiating.

Public Audit Committee

“Scotland’s colleges 2023”

Meeting date: 30 November 2023

Richard Leonard

We will take evidence in the new year from the Scottish Funding Council, but I note that, in an evidence-taking session with him, the Auditor General told us that, in 2020-21, three colleges out of 24 were in deficit, and that that rose to nine in 2021-22. I am not saying that there will be a linear progression but, if we extrapolate that rate of deficit growth, that would mean that every college in Scotland would be operating in deficit in the next financial year.

Public Audit Committee

“Scotland’s colleges 2023”

Meeting date: 30 November 2023

Richard Leonard

But, you are here, as a representative of the college principals group, so it is important that you are telling us that.

I will ask Stuart Brown about the reduction in the workforce. One of the points that the Auditor General makes in his report is that, although, on the whole, the public sector workforce has grown, the workforce in the further education sector has contracted. Do you want to comment on that or any of the other points that Derek Smeall introduced?

Public Audit Committee

“Scotland’s colleges 2023”

Meeting date: 30 November 2023

Richard Leonard

Thank you—that is clear. Andy Witty, can I ask you to broaden things out? The report identifies other risks that the college sector is up against. Could you elaborate on them and give us your view on them? Are there other risks that are not included in the Auditor General’s assessment?

Public Audit Committee

“Scotland’s colleges 2023”

Meeting date: 30 November 2023

Richard Leonard

Okay. As Stuart Brown called out Andy Witty’s organisation, I think that we need to give him the right to reply before we move on.

Public Audit Committee

“Scotland’s colleges 2023”

Meeting date: 30 November 2023

Richard Leonard

I am conscious of the time, and we are anxious, before we conclude, to cover topics such as the Scottish Funding Council’s new model of distribution and what impact that will have. We will also turn to the Withers review.

I invite the deputy convener, Sharon Dowey, to guide us through the final section of our discussion.

Public Audit Committee

“Scotland’s colleges 2023”

Meeting date: 30 November 2023

Richard Leonard

Okay—thank you. I know that Stuart Brown wants to come back in—you will have another opportunity, Stuart, before we finish up—but I am keen for Willie Coffey to lead the next part of the conversation.

Public Audit Committee

“Scotland’s colleges 2023”

Meeting date: 30 November 2023

Richard Leonard

John Mooney wants to come in on that point, and then we will move back to revenue, which Graham Simpson will lead on.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Adult mental health”

Meeting date: 23 November 2023

Richard Leonard

Jo Gibson, thank you very much for that perspective. It is a really good note on which to conclude our evidence session this morning.

I thank everyone who has taken part. I am sorry that we have had some technical difficulties, which has meant that not everyone has been able to hear everything and we have not been able to hear you as much as we would have liked. Apologies for that.

I thank our witnesses—those who joined us online, and Hannah and Richmond, who joined us in the committee room. It has been a valuable session for us. We have gathered a lot of important evidence, and we will have discussions about how best we can marshal that evidence in order to improve the resourcing of and support for the important work that you do and of which you have oversight. Thank you very much.

10:50 Meeting continued in private until 11:25.  

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Adult mental health”

Meeting date: 23 November 2023

Richard Leonard

I will kick us off by asking some questions, before bringing in other members of the committee. I am sure that you will have read the report, which is the genesis of our round-table discussions that have taken place over the past few weeks. It contains a recommendation that people should be provided

“with a choice about whether they access mental health services remotely”—

through telephone or videolink—

“or face-to-face”.

I wonder how you, as different agencies responsible for providing the services and for having oversight of them, respond to that recommendation. I will begin by asking Simon Burt to comment.