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Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 9 November 2025
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Displaying 3464 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

“Investing in Scotland’s infrastructure”

Meeting date: 7 March 2024

Richard Leonard

As we are on the subject of roads, I am not going to ask about a local bypass in my region or anything like that, but a broader and probably more profound point here is how you deal with competing interests. There is, of course, pressure for road building, road enhancements and so on, but such things might not be carbon neutral or carbon negative—they might be adding to emission levels. How do you reconcile the competing demands placed on you?

Public Audit Committee

“Investing in Scotland’s infrastructure”

Meeting date: 7 March 2024

Richard Leonard

Okay. I think that cohesion is what we are after here. We are looking for cohesion in the operational side as well as the administrative side to make sure that we maximise the opportunities.

Public Audit Committee

“Investing in Scotland’s infrastructure”

Meeting date: 7 March 2024

Richard Leonard

Is that capital or revenue, or both?

Public Audit Committee

“Investing in Scotland’s infrastructure”

Meeting date: 7 March 2024

Richard Leonard

Time permitting.

Public Audit Committee

“Investing in Scotland’s infrastructure”

Meeting date: 7 March 2024

Richard Leonard

Thank you. That was a very useful introduction to that area. It sparks off in my thought process the idea that we might want to have an evidence session just on that, because it is a big area, and it will get bigger over the next few years.

We are short on time, but the deputy convener has a final question or two about maintenance backlog and estate issues.

Public Audit Committee

“Investing in Scotland’s infrastructure”

Meeting date: 7 March 2024

Richard Leonard

Thank you very much for that answer. We are right out of time. I apologise. You might be exhausted, but we have not exhausted our questions, and we might wish to put some of them in writing to you as a follow-up.

I thank Alyson Stafford, Alison Cumming, Peter Reekie, Alan Morrison, Alison Irvine and Morag Angus for their contributions. Their evidence has been very helpful, and it is part of a continuing dialogue that we have around many of those areas, which are very much of interest for the Public Audit Committee.

I draw the public part of the meeting to a close. The committee will go into private session.

11:26 Meeting continued in private until 11:39.  

Public Audit Committee

Decision on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 7 March 2024

Richard Leonard

Good morning. I welcome everyone to the eighth meeting in 2024 of the Public Audit Committee.

The first item of business on our agenda was to consider our work programme in private, which we have now successfully done.

Agenda item 2 is a decision whether to take agenda items 4 and 5 in private. Does the committee agree to do so?

Members indicated agreement.

Public Audit Committee

“Investing in Scotland’s infrastructure”

Meeting date: 7 March 2024

Richard Leonard

I hope that you are not going to test me, director general.

Public Audit Committee

“Investing in Scotland’s infrastructure”

Meeting date: 7 March 2024

Richard Leonard

Members of the committee will probe those issues in a bit more detail.

During the evidence session that we had with the Auditor General in November, he welcomed the single Scottish estate approach as a useful first step, but it was pretty clear from what he told us that he felt that it fell short of what was really required. In other words, operational buildings are not part of that approach, or certainly were not at the point at which he was putting together his briefing. Do you have any reflections on that? His view, which the committee shares, is that it is important that consideration is given to how the whole estate can be properly used and maximised.

In recent weeks, we have taken evidence about the fact that parts of our infrastructure—whether in our prisons or the health service—are reaching the end of their lives; in many cases, they have gone beyond the end of their expected lives. How are you approaching the development of a single Scottish estate approach that also takes into account the operational buildings?

Public Audit Committee

“Investing in Scotland’s infrastructure”

Meeting date: 7 March 2024

Richard Leonard

Can I pick you up on the point about different governance arrangements? Are you saying that they are an impediment and that they prevent you from doing that, or are you saying something different?