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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 17 July 2025
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Displaying 3266 contributions

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Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Decision on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 24 May 2022

Gillian Martin

Welcome to the Health, Social Care and Sport Committee’s 19th meeting in 2022. I have received no apologies from members.

Item 1 is for the committee to decide whether to take items 3 and 4 in private. Do members agree to take those items in private?

Members indicated agreement.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Health Inequalities

Meeting date: 24 May 2022

Gillian Martin

Witnesses can, of course, make points that they want to make.

I am going to ask about human rights issues, but I will leave that until the end because my colleagues want to come in on some substantive issues. We move on to health inequalities impact assessments, with questions from Emma Harper.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Health Inequalities

Meeting date: 24 May 2022

Gillian Martin

Thank you for that recommendation. Claire Stevens’s question is one that we have as well. It strikes me that doing an inequalities impact assessment can save problems further down the line when projects are launched and policies are put into action.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Health Inequalities

Meeting date: 24 May 2022

Gillian Martin

Yes, we can hear you now. On you go.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Health Inequalities

Meeting date: 24 May 2022

Gillian Martin

That really goes to the heart of the matter, in our inquiry.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Health Inequalities

Meeting date: 24 May 2022

Gillian Martin

Thank you, David. You will notice that we switched you to audio only, which improved your signal quite a bit. We might not be able to see you, but we can certainly now hear you fine.

I will deal with a bit of housekeeping. To those of you joining us online—specifically, the two Davids, David Finch and David Walsh—if you want to come in on anything, please type R in the chat box and my clerk will let me know.

I want to pick up on a couple of things that were said in witnesses’ opening remarks. Gerry McCartney mentioned the place-based approach. I want to delve a bit deeper into your thoughts on that. You said that, to your mind, a place-based approach might not have the effect that people think that it will. We hear an awful lot about the issue from Government ministers and commentators generally. Can you expand on your point?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Health Inequalities

Meeting date: 24 May 2022

Gillian Martin

Claire Stevens earlier talked about those who have simply been left behind or overlooked by public policy and services. We heard from a lot of people in those marginalised groups in our two evidence sessions, a lot of whom had no recourse to public funds. Could you expand on your point? Who did you have in mind when you said that policies and services are not getting to those people or taking those people into account? Which policies and services did you have in mind?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Health Inequalities

Meeting date: 24 May 2022

Gillian Martin

The issue comes back to our general ethos as a health committee, which is that we think that every portfolio should have a health aspect to it, because quite a number of the drivers of health inequalities do not fall within the health portfolio. An example of that is transport. Quite a lot of the people to whom we spoke on Friday and Monday talked about the cost of transport and the cost of food, which they said were having an impact on their health and their ability to access services.

David, would you like to come in on Gillian Mackay’s question?

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Health Inequalities

Meeting date: 24 May 2022

Gillian Martin

Since no health committee meeting would be the same without this line of questioning, we move to questions from Paul O’Kane on the impact of Covid-19.

Health, Social Care and Sport Committee

Health Inequalities

Meeting date: 24 May 2022

Gillian Martin

In informal sessions, we certainly heard very strongly: “Don’t just consult us—involve us in the decision making”. Your point about almost road testing things with focus groups of people that the decisions will affect is absolutely important.

I will pick up on a few things with David Walsh before I open the discussion up to my colleagues.

David Walsh talked about mitigation measures and the issues that are faced when things outwith your control—in particular, austerity measures—have an impact. Obviously, austerity measures were put in place by those who thought they were a good idea, or to save money. However, what is the long-term cost of austerity measures when we look at what you said about the impact on people’s health? Where does the Scottish Government sit in relation to mitigation with a fixed budget?