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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 30 August 2025
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Displaying 1425 contributions

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Social Justice and Social Security Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 November 2022

Miles Briggs

As the bill progresses, I will want to make sure, through amendments, that that is delivered.

The minister started the evidence session by saying—the cabinet secretary also said this when he launched the bill—that the bill will end the postcode lottery of care in Scotland. We all want to see that, but this framework bill has been designed around the NHS. We have a postcode lottery in our NHS, and ministers are responsible for policy direction and delivery, so why will this be different?

I represent Edinburgh, which has some of the worst delayed discharge rates and some of the highest homelessness numbers in the country, and I worry that the bill will not necessarily change that. What learning will ministers who have been responsible for the NHS for 16 years bring to the bill?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 November 2022

Miles Briggs

All the committees that are looking at the NCS bill know that there is real concern out there in different sectors about what the service will look like and what detail they have not been part of. As the bill progresses through Parliament, it is critical that we start to get answers on that.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 November 2022

Miles Briggs

Good morning, minister, and good morning to your officials. I will ask a couple of questions that relate to some questions that have already been asked.

You said that you want to listen to folk whose rights are not being upheld and whose needs are not being met. Why, then, is the right to independent living not in the bill? In addition, given the concerns across Scotland about self-directed support—a policy with which we all agree—why is ensuring that we get that policy working properly not front and centre in the bill?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 November 2022

Miles Briggs

Thank you for that; that is helpful. For those of us who want to make sure that self-directed support is not lost in translation in the bill, part of that is about making sure that we work with—

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 November 2022

Miles Briggs

No, I was going to move on to my second question.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 November 2022

Miles Briggs

That was a comprehensive answer. Does anyone want to add to that?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 November 2022

Miles Briggs

Thank you for that. All the committees have been hearing that point with regard to the national care service.

I have a follow-up question about the progress that Parliament has made. None of us is saying that change does not have to happen, but, over the past decade, there have been reforms, such as the integration of health and social care—Rachel Cackett and I both worked on the Health and Care (Staffing) (Scotland) Act 2019—self-directed support, which we have already touched on, and carers breaks under the Carers (Scotland) Act 2016. Those reforms have not necessarily all been delivered, so could the move towards creating another organisation undermine those policies? We want all that progress to happen and we want it not to get lost in translation. What is your view on that? Rachel, do you want to kick off?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 November 2022

Miles Briggs

In our earlier evidence session, we heard about the diverse fabric of the social care sector and different models of interconnectivity between the NHS, councils, housing associations and employability services. However, I want to focus on homelessness provision, because that will not necessarily be transferred and it is not in the bill. There are concerns about the direct impact that the bill—and other bits of legislation that are coming forward—will have on the homelessness sector. What will be put in place to ensure effective joint working between homelessness services and the national care service?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 November 2022

Miles Briggs

I agree on that point.

Finally, minister—

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

National Care Service (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 November 2022

Miles Briggs

At the Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee meeting on Tuesday, I asked the same question. After this evidence session, the minister is coming in. What would you say to him? I will start with Sheena Arthur. I know that you are online, and we have not brought you in.

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