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Welcome back to the third part of today’s Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee meeting. This evidence session is a chance to consider the Scottish Government’s nomination for the chair of Environmental Standards Scotland, and I am pleased to welcome its nominee, Dr Richard Dixon, to the meeting. Appointments to the ESS board require parliamentary approval under the UK Withdrawal from the European Union (Continuity) (Scotland) Act 2021.

This evidence session is an opportunity to put questions to Dr Dixon about his vision for the role, and what qualities and experience he thinks he would bring to it, prior to Parliament considering a motion on his appointment. “Dr Dixon” is very formal. Richard, do you want to make an opening statement?

Thank you, convener. I always like to come to the petitions committee because of the wide range of subjects, but this petition is particularly personal for me. It revolves around the question of safeguarding children. The simple question that we seem to be faced with is: what price do we put on safeguarding children, and do we think that what we are doing at the moment is right?

If I may, convener, I will briefly allude to a story that I have been dealing with in my constituency. It relates to a child who was approached by a teacher who was making sexual comments and innuendo to that child. The child made a complaint and left the school before they had finished their schooling. The complaint took a very long time to go through the Highland Council, and the consequence was that the teacher was found guilty. However, there were complications in that some of the investigation was prolonged by the fact that the teacher in question had had a relationship with one of the people who was investigating, and the outcome was that the child failed to complete their education.

It is actually worse than that, because it was all a secret story that resulted in the teacher being dismissed and saying, “I’ve done nothing wrong” to members of the public and the child being unable to defend themselves because nothing was made clear. I believe that Highland Council misrepresented and did not carry out its safeguarding responsibilities for that child. The council ended up marking its own homework and keeping the results quiet and not publishing them. The long-term consequences happened purely to the child.

I struggled with that and with the parents having to deal with that, because it seems so wrong. I find it difficult to accept, which is why I absolutely believe that we need an independent inquiry and an independent national whistleblowing officer, so that parents can make sure that their children are actually safeguarded in schools. At the moment, in my humble opinion, the situation favours the employee, because the employer is investigating and has a responsibility for protecting the employee, however bad they have been, from the outcomes of any inquiries.

I raised that issue with the General Teaching Council in Scotland and I did not get an acceptable outcome, which is why I believe that the committee ought to consider the matter further and push the Government harder. Frankly, it does not know who will do the role. There was a question about cost, which is unacceptable. What cost do we place on safeguarding people? What cost do we place on safeguarding our children? Frankly, I do not think that the cost is too high, because we need to get it right.

I do not know what the deputy convener will speak about, but he wants to ask a question.

Before we leave the question on lotting, let us say that a 1,500 hectare estate that was suitable or partly forested came up for sale. If somebody decided that they wanted to invest in it or that they were going to get some investors together—whether a bank or individuals—they would know that, when they came to sell it, which they might be forced to do early, they would have to go through the lotting process, and, if the Land Commission’s proposals were in place, there could be a 90-day hold on the sale. Do you think that that would put investors off investing in that potential 1,500 hectares of woodland, which might meet the Government’s net zero targets?

I will ask each of you a question that requires one answer and then I will come back with a follow-up. Please do not be tempted to give more than one answer, because I will take your first one—it is a bit like those television games.

Halfway through the bill process, the Scottish Land Commission has come up with additional evidence on the size threshold for land management plans. It recently came up with recommendations on part 1 and I am led to believe that it will come up with further recommendations on part 2. It is somewhat late in the bill process, because we have already taken evidence from the SLC. It has recommended reducing the size threshold for land management plans from 3,000 hectares to 1,000 hectares. Can you give me one reason for or against that?

Okay. Given the fact that, based on the bill as it stands, the management plans are going to exist, whatever the size of the holding, somebody has to draw up that plan and bring it all together, including the community consultation. Sarah Madden, your organisation has been involved in that. If you include your volunteers’ time and all the other costs involved, how much will it cost to produce a management plan for a holding of, say, 1,000 hectares?

I understand that it might be formulaic and interpreted, but I am looking for actual time and costs. You are proposing to impose a cost on people and I am trying to understand whether you understand what that cost will be.

It would be useful to understand what you believe the cost of a management plan is.

David, you have done management plans. I think that some of them have worked and some have not: some have upset the community and some have not. How much do they cost to produce for 1,000 hectares?

No, sorry, I asked you a specific question and I am trying to get a specific answer. If you are not in a position to give me the answer, I am very happy to take a letter to the committee afterwards. From my point of view, I am trying to identify the costs of producing the plans. We have heard that it is £75,000 from, I think, Moray Estates, and a reasonable figure of £10,000 from somebody else. I am interested to know what you think those plans would cost, because I think that that burden is interesting.

With respect, I take the point that you have made. I have read the John Muir Trust accounts and seen where it is financially, so I understand some of the costs. I am just trying to identify them. Bob Doris, do you want to come in on that?