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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 20 June 2025
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Displaying 1200 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 12 November 2024

Liz Smith

When it comes to the public’s understanding of why Government makes a choice about what the money that they pay in tax will be used for and, more important, on what basis such decisions are made, it is an important principle that we should ensure that there is greater transparency for the public so that they can understand on what basis a specific decision has been made.

I cannot speak for the committee, but I think that we sometimes feel that it is not very easy for the committee to understand why a specific policy was put in place, given the other possible choices that could have been made. I would like to hear your thoughts on what we can do to improve that situation.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 12 November 2024

Liz Smith

Good try, Mr Greer.

I seek clarification on the £160 million that is being removed from social security. Of that amount, £148 million is a result of the UK Government changing eligibility criteria. The implication is that the remaining £12 million is to do with funding for staff and so on. Can you clarify that that is the case, because it seems to be quite a high figure?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 November 2024

Liz Smith

That was very helpful, because this is a huge area. The Scottish Fiscal Commission’s predictions with regard to fiscal spend over the next 50 years, whether it be in social security, social care or health, paint a pretty alarming picture. To ensure greater fiscal probity, we need to understand where the money is best spent, and that means that we—and this committee in particular—have to be able to assess where the impact is being felt and ensure that the data underlying all that is as accurate as possible. Any efforts that the Scottish Government can make to inform the committee of any gaps in the data would therefore be very helpful.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 November 2024

Liz Smith

I do not disagree with you, cabinet secretary, but I note that, in its most recent report, the Joseph Rowntree Foundation makes the point that it is quite difficult to measure a policy—one that it entirely approves of, as does the committee—its impact, whether it is delivering a better outcome and whether it is good management of public finances. That is quite important as the committee deliberates various social security policies.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 November 2024

Liz Smith

I have no issues with the instrument whatsoever; the Conservatives are very happy with it. However, cabinet secretary, I would like to probe a little bit further into some of the issues that arise from this kind of situation. In doing so, I go back to what you said at stage 1 of the Social Security (Amendment) (Scotland) Bill and, indeed, what the committee convener said at that time, which is that we have to ensure value for money. We get value for money if we have an effective impact assessment of the changes that we make to any of these things, and that, in turn, is determined by the data that is available.

You will be aware that, this morning, the Finance and Public Administration Committee has put out a very robust report on the need for much greater transparency and fiscal probity in the public finances. What is the Scottish Government doing to ensure that the measurement of the impacts of changes that are made in the social security brief helps those most in need and that we have the right data to assess that?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Interests

Meeting date: 31 October 2024

Liz Smith

I have no relevant interest to declare, convener, but I look forward to being on the committee.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 29 October 2024

Liz Smith

Exactly, cabinet secretary. If the arithmetic is slightly different in England from what it is in Scotland, we need to understand why, because that is the important point to consider when, as a committee, we make any decisions.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 29 October 2024

Liz Smith

The joint response to the consultation from both Governments made it clear that the levy is not expected to have any major impact on land prices. On what basis was that judgment made?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 29 October 2024

Liz Smith

I understand your point. However, the joint response notes that the modelling for the building safety levy in England suggests that, rather than impacting on property prices, it will impact on the price of land. The two countries are different, for the reasons that Stephen Lea-Ross set out. We do not have the same set-up of land ownership. Again, from the committee’s angle, the more evidence that we have, the more helpful that is for our decision making.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 29 October 2024

Liz Smith

It is an important issue. The nature of taxation is that there are behavioural changes as a result of any tax change, and elasticities to go with that. From what you have set out, cabinet secretary, I am not particularly opposed to the tax, but I think that the committee would like to see the evidence on which statements are based. If the change is not to have any major impact, we would like to see the evidence on that.