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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 18 September 2025
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Displaying 1257 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Liz Smith

Thank you.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Liz Smith

I have a question about fair funding. On Friday, I visited a voluntary group in my area, which argued strongly that, when it comes to getting funding, it is easier to get funding for specific projects than it is to get core funding to support the operation as a whole, which threatens the group’s sustainability and its long-term future. Is that something that the voluntary sector is concerned about across the board?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Liz Smith

Should there be more focus on zero-based budgeting when it comes to addressing what you have just said about the economic impact of specific spends and how they articulate with the Government’s priorities, as you mentioned earlier, not least in terms of the effectiveness of those spends but also the opportunity costs, which you said were very difficult to measure?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Liz Smith

That said, there are aspects of universal provision where money could be saved. To go back to free school meals, this was not part of the cabinet secretary’s evidence, but local authorities will tell you that, because of the number of free school meals that are not actually being used by those who are entitled, there is quite a lot of waste in the system. I would cite that personally as an example of where money could be saved.

The real point is whether the focus on universalism, which might in theory sound helpful, creates problems for the long-term fiscal sustainability of the country. We are surely in a very difficult period for that sustainability. I am just asking whether you think that some aspects of universalism must be reviewed.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Liz Smith

Do you share that view, Mr Robinson?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Liz Smith

I have a question about a comment that the cabinet secretary made in her evidence last week at the committee in relation to the free school meals policy. I know that you cannot comment on that specific policy, but she said:

“We will not be able to roll out the universal offer as far as we had perhaps initially wanted to”

because

“we have to prioritise those children who are most in need.”—[Official Report, Finance and Public Administration Committee, 2 September 2025; c 34.]

Without going into the details about free school meals, do you think that it would be helpful to have a debate about the effectiveness of universalism? To go back to my original questions, that would measure where the policy intention is having the most effect, as the cabinet secretary was implying, and perhaps less effect when it is being given to people who do not require that universal benefit. Would that be helpful?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Government and Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 2 September 2025

Liz Smith

It also means that there is a bit of a vacuum now. People are trying to do the right thing but they do not know whether what they do will be accurate, because they do not have the necessary data.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Government and Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 2 September 2025

Liz Smith

Is there any optimism about how we will get that data? This is a crucial problem in policy making, particularly with regard to longer-term sustainability, because we will not achieve that unless we are able to increase the revenues that come into the economy. Not knowing where that revenue might come from is a pretty serious problem. Do we have any optimistic outlooks?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Government and Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 2 September 2025

Liz Smith

If I may, I will focus on the revenue side of the budget. Professor Roy, you said earlier that most of the data that you require to estimate revenues is RTI data that comes from HMRC, but when we are looking for fiscal sustainability in the long term, we need more data than that, particularly data on the labour market. You said that you have concerns about the fact that a lot of data on the labour market is missing. Could you tell us a bit more about those concerns? Trends such as the number of people in work, as opposed to the number of those who are out of work, whether through unemployment or inactivity, really matter for the future. The projections for ensuring fiscal sustainability are very dependent on our having that data, some of which we do not appear to have. Could you say a bit more about that?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Government and Scottish Fiscal Commission (Publications)

Meeting date: 2 September 2025

Liz Smith

Can I dig a bit deeper into why the data is not there? Obviously, having it is critical for longer-term planning.