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Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 22 May 2025
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Displaying 1923 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Adult mental health”

Meeting date: 9 November 2023

Graham Simpson

Yes. If people are going to do something, whatever it is, they need to know that it is working and why it works—or why it does not work. You are billed here as the voice of experience, so tell us about your experience.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Adult mental health”

Meeting date: 9 November 2023

Graham Simpson

Yes. By the way, the witnesses who are online can just put up their hands or whatever they need to do online to come in—it does not all have to be Jo Anderson. However, something that Jo said struck me, because I think that it affects everyone and not just people who are suffering with mental health problems. Getting to see your GP is probably more difficult now than it ever has been.

If someone has a mental health issue—as we all know, there is a broad range of mental health issues—their first step is to get past a receptionist, who they might have to phone up to see their GP. If their GP is anything like mine, they will have to describe their condition, but they might not want to tell somebody who is not a GP that they have a mental health issue. Do witnesses think that that is putting people off even seeking help, let alone getting it?

I suppose the follow-up question is whether the GP is the best person to go to, or whether there is anywhere else that people could go.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Adult mental health”

Meeting date: 9 November 2023

Graham Simpson

While Kirsten Urquhart is still with us—I know that you have to shoot off—I want to come back to your comment that the world feels like a “heavy place for everyone”. Is there a danger of giving the impression that we have a nation of stressed-out young people who are struggling with life? That is not the case for every young person, is it? Some young people struggle, but not everyone is in that place, and we do not want to give that impression, do we?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Adult mental health”

Meeting date: 9 November 2023

Graham Simpson

There are examples in Scotland of various organisations doing their own thing but, as you say, we do not have a nationwide approach.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Adult mental health”

Meeting date: 9 November 2023

Graham Simpson

Obviously, coercion is a big deal for you—you have mentioned it quite a few times. Does anyone else want to come in? I am going to look at a screen with lots of faces on it and—

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Adult mental health”

Meeting date: 9 November 2023

Graham Simpson

What questions did you ask? If you ask, “Do you get stressed about things?”, most people will say yes. It depends on what you ask and how you phrase a question.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Adult mental health”

Meeting date: 9 November 2023

Graham Simpson

I am glad that you have injected some positivity. I know that you have to shoot off, so I will let you go, but thanks for that—I appreciate it.

I will put my next question just to Jo Anderson, because we are up against the clock. You mentioned outcomes, and the report states:

“The Scottish Government does not measure the quality of services or outcomes for people receiving mental healthcare.”

That seems to me to be a huge oversight. If you accept that the situation should be rectified, how should it be rectified, and what kind of things should we measure?

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Adult mental health”

Meeting date: 9 November 2023

Graham Simpson

That is possibly a question for the Scottish Government, and we will have it in at some point.

I have a separate question about something that arises in the report. This is not necessarily a question for Jo Anderson—I am just looking at you because you are in the room, but it could be for anyone. The report says that spending on medicines to deal with mental health has gone down, because the cost of drugs has gone down, but that the number of items being dispensed has gone up. Does anyone have a view on whether it is appropriate that we are prescribing more and more drugs? Are there better ways of dealing with mental health issues? Is it too easy to prescribe drugs?

I see someone nodding, and I think that it is Simon Porter, so he might want to come in on that.

Public Audit Committee

Section 23 Report: “Adult mental health”

Meeting date: 9 November 2023

Graham Simpson

Right. Paula Fraser was mentioned first.

Public Audit Committee

“Investing in Scotland’s infrastructure”

Meeting date: 2 November 2023

Graham Simpson

But what is that an estimate of?