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Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 1 May 2025
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Displaying 1857 contributions

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Public Audit Committee

“Fiscal sustainability and public reform in Scotland”

Meeting date: 5 March 2025

Graham Simpson

It seems a pretty obvious approach, though, does it not? If you are going to reduce spending, you might as well look at the impact of doing so. I am surprised that it has not been done before.

Public Audit Committee

“Fiscal sustainability and public reform in Scotland”

Meeting date: 5 March 2025

Graham Simpson

You accept, therefore, the potential risk that bringing in the levy could mean a loss of trade, if you like, for parts of Scotland.

Public Audit Committee

“Fiscal sustainability and public reform in Scotland”

Meeting date: 5 March 2025

Graham Simpson

Will you give us a bit more detail on the invest to save fund that you mentioned?

Public Audit Committee

“Fiscal sustainability and public reform in Scotland”

Meeting date: 5 March 2025

Graham Simpson

Yes—thanks a lot, convener. Permanent secretary, you have mentioned child poverty a few times. I draw your attention to a correction that the First Minister had to make to an answer that he gave to the Parliament on 27 February, on the Scottish child payment. In his original answer, he said:

“the Scottish child payment ... is helping to lift hundreds of thousands of children out of poverty.”—[Official Report, 27 February 2025; c 18.]

In his correction, he says that it is

“estimated”

to be

“helping to keep 100,000 children out of relative poverty”.—[Official Report, 27 February 2025; c 121.]

That is an estimate, and the term has gone from “poverty” to “relative poverty”. Is it fair to say that we do not actually know how many children have been helped?

Public Audit Committee

“Fiscal sustainability and public reform in Scotland”

Meeting date: 5 March 2025

Graham Simpson

Thank you.

Public Audit Committee

“Fiscal sustainability and public reform in Scotland”

Meeting date: 5 March 2025

Graham Simpson

If we look at pay deals, which are covered from paragraph 38 onwards of the Auditor General’s report and in exhibit 5, we see that some of them are frankly unsustainable. How will you be able to fund those in future years?

Public Audit Committee

“Fiscal sustainability and public reform in Scotland”

Meeting date: 5 March 2025

Graham Simpson

What kinds of bids are coming in?

Public Audit Committee

“Fiscal sustainability and public reform in Scotland”

Meeting date: 5 March 2025

Graham Simpson

Okay. The Auditor General told us a bit more about how the Welsh Government undertakes forecasting and reporting at the evidence session that we had in December, and we were told that it

“published a strategic integrated impact assessment that looked at the impact that reductions in spending might have on different groups.”—[Official Report, Public Audit Committee, 5 December 2024; c 7.]

Is that something that you are looking to copy or adapt in some way?

Public Audit Committee

“Fiscal sustainability and public reform in Scotland”

Meeting date: 5 March 2025

Graham Simpson

It might be the right objective, but the point that the report makes is that hitting that objective will take a lot more money than is likely to be there. That is the nub of it, is it not?

Public Audit Committee

“Fiscal sustainability and public reform in Scotland”

Meeting date: 5 March 2025

Graham Simpson

To bring all that together, if we accept that there are funding gaps—for social security, the figure is not too distant from being a very big funding gap, and we have spoken about pay deals—and if the Scottish Government is to make such policy choices, which I accept are not yours but those of ministers, it will have to look at making savings or cuts in other areas, will it not?