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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 5 February 2026
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Displaying 2565 contributions

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Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Decision on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 11 September 2025

Bob Doris

Good morning, everyone, and welcome to the 22nd meeting in 2025 of the Social Justice and Social Security Committee. We have apologies from our convener, Collette Stevenson, and from Michael Marra. Unfortunately, neither of them can be with us this morning.

The committee dealt with its first agenda item in private. We now move to agenda item 2, which is a decision on taking business in private. Does the committee agree to take agenda item 4 in private?

Members indicated agreement.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 11 September 2025

Bob Doris

Thank you very much. Disability payments were mentioned, so it would be appropriate to bring in Edel Harris next. I have no doubt that she will have something meaningful to say.

What evidence do we have that such investment is making a real difference, Edel? We know that there are gaps, because at last week’s committee session we learned that it was not clear how many people who claim ADP are in work and how many are out of work. We got some evidence on that from Emma Jackson, but where are the gaps? It would be quite helpful to have more information.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 11 September 2025

Bob Doris

I will bring in Emma Jackson and will ask what will be my last question. Jeremy Balfour has a supplementary question and my other colleagues want to come in with a whole range of questions.

Are there any payments that are not value for money? I am sorry, Emma—you can swerve that if you like.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 11 September 2025

Bob Doris

Who is that question for, Jeremy?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 11 September 2025

Bob Doris

I apologise—it is just that that might enable us to end the meeting at the appropriate time.

Jeremy Balfour, I believe that you are going to lead on the next theme.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 11 September 2025

Bob Doris

I apologise for waiting until the very end to ask this question, which is about what you would ask for if more money became available. Chris Birt might remember that I asked a similar question last year.

The Scottish Government has invested £1.3 billion in positive policy initiatives, such as the Scottish child payment and adult disability payments, for the purpose of mitigation. That additional investment is now locked into the system. If I said, “I have just found £100 million! Where did that come from?”, would you use it to take a cash-first approach? Would you provide other services? Childcare was mentioned, for example. How would you direct the money? What would your priorities be?

I know that you want to say all of the above, but that is not how it works. I know that such questions are for politicians, but you are here today, so what would your main ask be? Ask one thing, if possible.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 11 September 2025

Bob Doris

I sometimes feel that the heft of the Scottish child payment is so significant that other investments somehow become the poor relations when it comes to scrutiny and assessment of value for money. It is not that I do not want to hear more about the Scottish child payment, but I would quite like to hear more about whether other investments are value for money.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 11 September 2025

Bob Doris

Before I move on to Marie McNair, I am conscious that Edel Harris has not had the opportunity to comment on some of the things that she has been involved in to her fingertips very recently. Do you have any final comments on this section, Edel, before we move on?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 11 September 2025

Bob Doris

In the interests of not incurring the wrath of the convener, who is not here, I should say that our committee produced a significant report on multiyear funding for third sector and voluntary organisations. The Government has been responding positively to that, and we will continue to follow that up as a committee. I say that for our convener, Collette Stevenson, so that I do not get into trouble.

I will bring in Carol Mochan.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 11 September 2025

Bob Doris

I need to give a bit of a time check—it is partly my fault, because I spent so long on theme 1. Time is catching up with us a little bit, so my apologies in advance if I step in to move things along.