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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 4 August 2025
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Displaying 2048 contributions

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Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 February 2025

Bob Doris

Yes—they would not necessarily be to catch the landowner out but to see what is happening out there in the real world and make recommendations about how land management plans can be improved more generally.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 February 2025

Bob Doris

That was a helpful conversation between Mr Fleetwood and the convener. The debate is really about the cost versus the affordability of land management plans.

We have heard evidence through our scrutiny that good landowners will already be doing all the things that you would expect to see in a land management plan. That will now be placed on a statutory footing. Landowners come to the committee and tell us that they do the consultation anyway. Is it not the case, convener—the question is for Mr Fleetwood, of course—that good landowners would have nothing to fear and that the work to draw up a land management plan, including community consultation, should already be taking place, if they are a good, responsible landowner? What are your thoughts on that?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 February 2025

Bob Doris

That is helpful. The committee has to contrast cost and affordability with what best practice looks like out there.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 February 2025

Bob Doris

Does anyone else have thoughts on that?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 February 2025

Bob Doris

It does help. I have a final brief question, which I will ask more about later. Is that an argument for a proportionate approach to what the new commission would deem to be an appropriate level of endeavour to produce a good-quality plan rather than an argument against land management plans? Is it more about being balanced in how we take this forward, rather than about not taking it forward?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 February 2025

Bob Doris

The provision says that there should be a reasonable grounds test. The commissioner could say, for example, that they have not had a formal report of a potential breach from a group that has a statutory right to report it, but that something has been brought to their attention and that they have reasonable grounds to investigate—there will be a permissive power to investigate. Are you fine with that, Max?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 February 2025

Bob Doris

Okay. Sarah, I want to know whether you have a view on my follow-up question.

The bill will be amended and I imagine that it will be enacted, and we will be left thinking about what the quality of land management plans across the country will be—whether we decide on 3,000 hectares or 1,000 hectares. We will also be left wondering what outcomes we have achieved. Should the new commissioner do a bit of sampling of land management plans to ensure that they are of good quality and that they have positive outcomes, rather than waiting for a breach? What about a proactive role for the new commissioner? Maybe a sample survey of various landowners’ land management plans could be carried out to drive up good practice.

There will also be some plans that do not cut it—not because of wilful acting against the interests of communities but only because landowners have not got it together. What are your thoughts on a proactive role for the new commissioner?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 February 2025

Bob Doris

I get all that, and although that answer is very helpful, I am slightly concerned that work that landowners are doing anyway and that has a cost to it will be subsumed under what will be a new endeavour for the land management plan, and that it will be quantified as a cost of the new endeavour rather than an on-going cost that exists anyway, as Mr Carlow has outlined.

Mr Clark, it sounds to me as though those tens of thousands of pounds are moneys that will be spent anyway on all the things that we would expect responsible large landowners to do as a matter of course. Will you say more about what happens already and whether there is a cost to that? Are we perhaps double-counting some of the costs?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 February 2025

Bob Doris

I want to ask a little about how we identify breaches in land management plans. The commission has recommended that the proposed new land and communities commissioner should have the power to instigate investigations into potential breaches resulting from a lack of a proper community consultation and engagement process. It has also recommended that the commissioner also have a more general power to instigate its own investigations, irrespective of who can or cannot report a breach, if the new commissioner is aware that there are reasonable grounds that there has been a breach about any matter to do with land management plans, and not specifically to do with a consultation. I would like Mr Carlow’s initial views on that.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Land Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 4 February 2025

Bob Doris

I do not want to put words in your mouth, but are you, in effect, saying that, although it is perfectly good to award the power, because of the resource that an individual commissioner might have their ability to use it might be pretty limited?