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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 8 July 2025
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Displaying 2048 contributions

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Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Natural Capital Finance

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Bob Doris

I do not wish to make things more complicated than they have to be. I think that what I am hearing from you is that some of the yield will be in, for example, year 5, year 10, year 15 , year 20 and so on, and that those investing can take some of that yield now by selling PIUs on to others, which will allow them to do some of the work that must be done. This might be overly simplistic, but are PIUs a way of getting money out in the early years for gains that will come in future years? Have I got that bit right?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Natural Capital Finance

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Bob Doris

I know that that is a very simplistic way of looking at it. In that case, I have a different question. Sorry about that, convener.

I am sorry that the witnesses do not have in front of them the table that I am looking at. I suppose that we will soon have estimates for 2023-24 under the woodland and peatland carbon codes. However, no one is citing what future investments might look like. If we were talking about housing, for example, we would know that there was £X million-worth of investment in the background, how many units that might represent, what the yield might look like and so on. How can we track what future investment might look like? Is that quantified anywhere?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Natural Capital Finance

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Bob Doris

Okay. I appreciate your trying to answer that question as best you could, based on what I was asking you.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Natural Capital Finance

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Bob Doris

I think that it is fair to say that members will be on a learning curve for some of this.

What levels of activity are there in natural capital finance in Scotland, and what impact is that having on land use? Convener, I have a supplementary question, which I will roll in due to time constraints, so that I do not have to come in twice on the same point.

My questions are about current levels of activity and the impact that that is having on land use. It would also be interesting for anyone who is watching the session to get an idea of your organisation’s interest in the sector, to give a context to your evidence. Perhaps Stuart Greenwood could start.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Natural Capital Finance

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Bob Doris

That is helpful, because, in evidence, we are hearing about modest numbers, but the activity with regard to woodland has trebled in four years. To an outsider, that looks like significant growth, but it is still relatively modest, given what we have to do.

I will move on. It was helpful to get everyone to set the scene, but it might be that not everyone will need to answer my next question. We are keen to know what is motivating different actors to engage in the area. What is making investors get involved? For example, what is motivating land managers to develop and certify projects, and what is motivating investors and buyers on the market side? What is getting those investors involved and land managers to come to the table and play games? What are the driving factors? A couple of witnesses might want to get some of that information on the record. Mr Paterson is nodding at me, so I suspect that he wants to come in.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Natural Capital Finance

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Bob Doris

On diversification, Mr Paterson talked about revenues. Does any witness have anything to add that is not already on the record?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Natural Capital Finance

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Bob Doris

I apologise, but I was talking about investment. We are looking at different outcomes and at how we leverage in finance to do some of the environmental work. I do not want to ask someone else’s question, convener, but I was clarifying that the trend appears to be up but that the level is still relatively modest in global numbers.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Natural Capital Finance

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Bob Doris

Thank you. I apologise for cutting you off, Mr Young.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Natural Capital Finance

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Bob Doris

It is always dangerous to ask a question when I am not quite clear on the context. You mention return. Is there a yield on that? Can you quantify it in percentage terms? Would 5 per cent be an impressive yield for such a financial investment? What are we looking at? I get that investors might want to do the right thing, but there is a financial imperative—they want to make money.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Natural Capital Finance

Meeting date: 26 March 2024

Bob Doris

Thank you. Mr Young wants to come in.