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Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 21 October 2025
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Displaying 1141 contributions

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Education, Children and Young People Committee

Scottish Attainment Challenge Inquiry

Meeting date: 18 May 2022

Shirley-Anne Somerville

At the individual school level, there is the school improvement plan work. Parents and indeed young people should play an important part in that. We should not forget the importance of listening to young people as part of that work. In the national setting, we are very keen to ensure that the voice of parents comes through in different parts of policy right across education. We have connections at both official and ministerial levels with parents’ groups and we hear directly from them. They also play an important part in the Scottish education council, which ensures that they are involved.

Although teachers know their young people best and we should have an empowered system, part of a headteacher’s work is to take account of parents’ views as they deliver school improvement work, and I think that that is to everyone’s benefit.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Scottish Attainment Challenge Inquiry

Meeting date: 18 May 2022

Shirley-Anne Somerville

With this type of work, there are two possible approaches. We could do it with a top-down approach, where I sit in St Andrew’s house dictating policy and a target, or we can work with local government, which has responsibility to deliver education. We are working in partnership between national and local government so that local authorities can set the aims that are correct for their areas. There will be different local authority aims as they come through. I prefer not to have a top-down approach; I prefer to work with local government. Of course, our ambition is no less than to close the attainment gap, but we need to recognise that that is a long-term endeavour. Indeed, you quoted Audit—

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Scottish Attainment Challenge Inquiry

Meeting date: 18 May 2022

Shirley-Anne Somerville

You quoted Audit Scotland, which has said:

“Reducing the poverty-related attainment gap is a complex challenge and will take time”.

It will take time to deliver the reductions in the poverty-related attainment gap, but we are determined to see a greater pace of progress than we had before the pandemic, and the stretch aims are an important part of that.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Scottish Attainment Challenge Inquiry

Meeting date: 18 May 2022

Shirley-Anne Somerville

I am clear that we need more transparency in the area. As a national Government, we have listened to what Audit Scotland has said. Once the data is in a state that can be published and once we have collated all the data from the local authorities, absolutely, I see no reason not to publish. I would, of course, expect local authorities to publish the data as and when they set their stretch aims, because that is part of their local improvement work. There should not be a secretive manner of development at local or national level. We will absolutely make sure that material is published to allow people to see what is happening locally and at a national level.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Scottish Attainment Challenge Inquiry

Meeting date: 18 May 2022

Shirley-Anne Somerville

Approximately, yes.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Scottish Attainment Challenge Inquiry

Meeting date: 18 May 2022

Shirley-Anne Somerville

I appreciate that there are different measures that we could use, but I have explained the reason why we decided to stay with PEF. I have also explained that I decided to change other parts of the system in recognition of the fact that poverty exists right across Scotland. The fact that we are not using the Scottish index of multiple deprivation, or not using a bid process, which is what has happened before, allowed us to look at children and low-income families who needed help right across Scotland, including in rural areas.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Scottish Attainment Challenge Inquiry

Meeting date: 18 May 2022

Shirley-Anne Somerville

I am very happy to meet the constituents that Oliver Mundell has in mind to discuss that. He can send me the details. The Scottish Government is putting in support to assist with Ukrainian children and young people who come here. It will be a difficult time of year to enter the education system, and that will understandably impact on what can be done in the academic year. A great deal of work is being done by local authorities and individual schools to support particular families, because every circumstance will be different. If there is a role that I or Education Scotland can play in smoothing any of that over, we will be pleased to do so.

Education Scotland has put in national resources to assist with Ukrainian students and families who are coming over and moving into the system. There is a lot more in the discussion about what we are doing in education to support Ukrainian nationals, but with the time constraints I am happy to deal with those questions offline.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Scottish Attainment Challenge Inquiry

Meeting date: 18 May 2022

Shirley-Anne Somerville

Yes. I should be clear that we do not want to stop local variation in how schools develop policies and tackle the attainment gap. At the end of the day, we are concerned about variation in outcomes. We are certainly not looking at a one-size-fits-all approach. Education Scotland is doing a great deal of work to provide universal support to all local authorities in Scotland, and it can give more targeted support to the local authorities that are most in need. It might do that by looking at the highest levels of poverty in an area or through dialogue with a local authority when it or Education Scotland has identified that more targeted support is needed. Intensive support can also be provided when we see limited progress.

It is key that Education Scotland is there for every local authority. It will support and work collaboratively with schools and local authorities, and it will challenge, when necessary, if we do not see the progress that we might have expected though the work.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Scottish Attainment Challenge Inquiry

Meeting date: 18 May 2022

Shirley-Anne Somerville

The local authorities’ stretch aims need to be in by September. Obviously, once those are collated and we ensure that we have the correct information from local authorities, I would like to publish very soon after that.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Scottish Attainment Challenge Inquiry

Meeting date: 18 May 2022

Shirley-Anne Somerville

We would expect to see significant progress. The challenge that we have coming out of Covid is that the progress that was being made pre-pandemic has been impacted by Covid as teachers are working day in, day out to support children and young people through the impact of Covid. The entire purpose of having the refresh and making the changes that we have made is that we expect not only progress but accelerated progress compared to pre-pandemic levels.