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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 11 November 2025
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Displaying 1699 contributions

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Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (North-east and Moray)

Meeting date: 10 January 2024

Claire Baker

Thank you, minister.

I will start with a question about the meaning of “just transition”. Witnesses in the inquiry have given a number of definitions. We went up to Aberdeen to take evidence. Aberdeen City Council said that there is some confusion in Government about the meaning of the concept of a just transition, which leads to funding programmes in which the intent is not clear. A lot of the discussion was about the difference between a just transition and an energy transition.

Does there need to be a better definition? You said at the start that it is “a living, breathing concept”. It is about achieving balance between flexibility and the need to change and adapt, and clarity, so that everyone knows what they are working towards. Does there need to be more work on defining what a just transition means for the north-east and Moray?

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (North-east and Moray)

Meeting date: 10 January 2024

Claire Baker

Mr Stewart, this will be your final question.

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (North-east and Moray)

Meeting date: 10 January 2024

Claire Baker

Before I bring in Murdo Fraser, let me just say that linked to that is the issue of planning. Groups have been organising over how long it takes to get consents. SSE has said:

“Currently, the average offshore wind farm takes around 12 years to deliver and major network infrastructure can take even longer”.

Although the national planning framework addressed some of the issues with that, there is still a recognition that it is a long process. It is very time consuming, and it can damage our ability to be an early mover on some of this. I know that you are not the planning minister, but can you tell us what action the Government is taking in that respect? Is there a recognition of how long consents take and of how that creates a barrier for business to move forward in this area?

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (North-east and Moray)

Meeting date: 10 January 2024

Claire Baker

As other members have said, there is an issue around the yearly allocation of the fund. You said that this year is when you will perhaps look to review the fund. We met local groups and, although they are all grateful for the money that they have received, which is making a difference to their organisations, they spoke about the timescales that they had to work to, especially for capital projects, and the fact that it had to be something that was ready to go, rather than something that they were working towards. In our report, the committee will reflect on how the fund was distributed and what improvements can be made to that.

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (North-east and Moray)

Meeting date: 10 January 2024

Claire Baker

Being transformational is not always about energy change, which you gave as an example. Such change benefits us in achieving net zero, because we are decarbonising, but being transformational is also about investing in and empowering a community. That goes back to some of the other questions about previous deindustrialisation, in which communities were left behind. It is about understanding what transformational is. It is about the nuts and bolts of making the change and getting us to net zero, but it is also about how you transform a community and involve it in the process.

You will know that we did an inquiry into Grangemouth. The committee took further evidence on Grangemouth, because we are concerned about the announcements on that. From the outside, it looks concerning; it does not really look like a just transition. It is about how we prevent that and make sure that the investment goes directly to communities and empowers them to take more ownership of projects.

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (North-east and Moray)

Meeting date: 10 January 2024

Claire Baker

It is a very open question.

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (North-east and Moray)

Meeting date: 10 January 2024

Claire Baker

That might be something that we will pick up. We might contact the minister, because, although the update is welcome, there is concern around the attached timescales and how long it will take to deliver those changes.

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (North-east and Moray)

Meeting date: 10 January 2024

Claire Baker

Thank you.

That brings us to the end of this morning’s evidence session. I thank the minister and Catriona Laing for joining us. We now move into private session.

10:52 Meeting continued in private until 11:24.  

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (North-east and Moray)

Meeting date: 10 January 2024

Claire Baker

Good morning, and welcome to the first meeting in 2024 of the Economy and Fair Work Committee. Our first item of business is the final evidence session in our inquiry into a just transition for the north-east and Moray.

I welcome the Minister for Small Business, Innovation, Tourism and Trade, Richard Lochhead. He is joined by Catriona Laing, who is deputy director for climate change in the Scottish Government.

If members and witnesses could keep their questions and answers as concise as possible, that would be helpful. I invite the minister to make a short opening statement.

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Just Transition (North-east and Moray)

Meeting date: 10 January 2024

Claire Baker

Okay. Thank you. I will bring in Maggie Chapman, who will be followed by Kevin Stewart.