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Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 11 February 2026
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Displaying 2804 contributions

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Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Climate Change (Emissions Reduction Targets) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 24 September 2024

Mark Ruskell

Obviously, we are waiting to see the Climate Change Committee’s advice on the first budget next spring. Claudia Cowie and Alison Leslie, do you think that the move to this budgeting process will change anything in relation to your target setting? We understand that councils have their own corporate targets for carbon reduction; some have area-wide reduction targets, too. Has there been any implication that if, say, the budget comes up with an ambition that is less than the current target, you will have to look again at your targets, or will you still be on the same trajectory unless guidance tells you that you need to re-examine things?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Climate Change (Emissions Reduction Targets) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 24 September 2024

Mark Ruskell

Do you think that you will need to revisit your own targets and action planning as a result of what comes out of this bill, which takes more of a budget approach? We are struggling to work out the bill’s practical implications for people who are delivering the targets.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Climate Change (Emissions Reduction Targets) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 24 September 2024

Mark Ruskell

Okay. Do other witnesses have any thoughts on that?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Climate Change (Emissions Reduction Targets) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 24 September 2024

Mark Ruskell

That is a level of detail that will not come out of the bill at the moment. The expectation is for the Climate Change Committee to produce a pathway, which is more high level. Are you saying that there is a need for more detail up front? Obviously, you cannot provide the final plan, but there is a space where there is a need for more detail. Is that what I am getting from the panel? Does anybody want to come back on that point?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Climate Change (Emissions Reduction Targets) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 24 September 2024

Mark Ruskell

It might not be only the Climate Change Committee that raises concerns. You, Environmental Standards Scotland and others might also do that.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Climate Change (Emissions Reduction Targets) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 24 September 2024

Mark Ruskell

Are there any other brief comments on that?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Climate Change (Emissions Reduction Targets) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 24 September 2024

Mark Ruskell

What would that look like? Would there be a requirement in the plan to deal with public participation and engagement? As I mentioned, the 2019 act had at its heart a specific requirement for a citizens assembly, but that is only one way to cut it with regard to public engagement. I am interested in your thoughts about how we cement public engagement in the plan as we move forward.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Climate Change (Emissions Reduction Targets) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 24 September 2024

Mark Ruskell

I want to pin things down a bit more. Are you saying that you would be happy for a draft budget to be presented alongside a draft plan, because you cannot finalise a plan until you have finalised a budget? There is a chicken-and-egg element. What is helpful when you are making decisions about the budget in line with the action that might be possible, without plans being completely finalised ahead of setting the budget, if you know what I mean? It is very much a chicken-and-egg situation.

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee

Climate Change (Emissions Reduction Targets) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 24 September 2024

Mark Ruskell

Yes. I want to ask Cornilius Chikwama about Audit Scotland’s view on where the Scottish Government is. Audit Scotland produced a report some time ago that looked at the need for effective assurance, enhanced governance and workforce planning within the director general for net zero’s area. This meeting is an opportunity to reflect on whether governance is set up correctly in relation to the bill. Does Audit Scotland have concerns about progress in that regard, or are you content with the fact that the Government is taking on the reforms that you have highlighted?

Net Zero, Energy and Transport Committee [Draft]

Climate Change (Emissions Reduction Targets) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 September 2024

Mark Ruskell

I am wondering where the big mystery is with the climate change plan. The UK Climate Change Committee has given the Government advice for a number of years. It has set out what the pathway to 2045 looks like. You have had annual advice from the UK CCC. What it will present next spring will not focus primarily on the next climate change plan but on the plans to follow on the route to 2045. What is the gap? What is the big mystery? Surely the Government must have already mapped out the pathway towards the next target and the next budget. It will have a clear idea about what actions are needed in particular sectors, from transport to agriculture to energy. As you say, none of that is a mystery.

Given that this is a living document—a living piece of work in Government—why can it not be shared with the committee ahead of our effectively changing the legislation, ditching the 2030 and 2040 targets and moving to a completely new system of budget setting? Why can that not be revealed? What is the big mystery here?

11:30