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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 16 May 2025
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Displaying 3259 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scotland’s Commissioner Landscape

Meeting date: 4 June 2024

Kenneth Gibson

We are straying off the topic of commissioners here.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scotland’s Commissioner Landscape

Meeting date: 4 June 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I hope that it is not going to be a morning of ducking and diving, and bobbing and weaving.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scotland’s Commissioner Landscape

Meeting date: 4 June 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I have a final question. Way back in 2007, one of our predecessor committees said:

“Policy papers accompanying new proposals for officeholders should provide strong evidence that the proposer has explored all possible opportunities to have an existing body carry out the additional function or make use of existing resources wherever possible to support any new office-holder and have very good reasons for not adopting an approach which would avoid the creation of a new body”.

The committee highlighted that the then Scottish Commissioner for Children and Young People was in an anomalous position because those criteria would not have been met had it been set up any time since 2007. That commissioner is, of course, still in existence 17 years later. Do the criteria that were set out by our predecessor committee form part of the ministerial control framework?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scotland’s Commissioner Landscape

Meeting date: 4 June 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Monie a mickle maks a muckle, minister.

On a number of occasions, you have talked about the robustness of the Government in assessing new commissioners. I wonder why, therefore, we are still progressing not just with the victims and witnesses commissioner, but with a proposed future generations commissioner and a disability commissioner. How do they fit into the context of the ministerial control framework?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scotland’s Commissioner Landscape

Meeting date: 4 June 2024

Kenneth Gibson

So, you are saying that they may not transpire.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scotland’s Commissioner Landscape

Meeting date: 4 June 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Improvement never stops, but I always find that, if there is no deadline for delivery, things drag on and on, and we will still be discussing the same thing this time next year. Frankly, I have found that to be the case in all my years in local government and in the Scottish Parliament.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scotland’s Commissioner Landscape

Meeting date: 4 June 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I like to give everybody that chance.

That concludes our public deliberations.

10:40 Meeting continued in private until 10:55.  

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scotland’s Commissioner Landscape

Meeting date: 4 June 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I think that it is more about perception than reality, but perception is very important. I am just wondering why the Government decided on a victims and witnesses commissioner, because the Criminal Justice Committee was against such a commissioner. One of the reasons for that was the fact that there are already a lot of independent bodies in that area—the committee cited a number of those, including His Majesty’s Inspectorate of Prisons for Scotland and His Majesty’s Inspectorate of Constabulary in Scotland. Therefore, it did not think that there was a gap to be closed. Why is the Government suggesting commissioners in such situations?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scotland’s Commissioner Landscape

Meeting date: 4 June 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Thank you very much, minister.

You touched on the ministerial control framework, and you made it clear how keen you are to improve efficiency and effectiveness. The Government is proposing to introduce a victims and witnesses commissioner, which the Criminal Justice Committee does not seem to be very keen on, and we heard from a couple of former MSPs who put forward proposals for commissioners, one of whom did not think that their proposal for such a commissioner was a good idea any more. Is that something that the Government is looking at, with a view to not taking that forward?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scotland’s Commissioner Landscape

Meeting date: 4 June 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I said that that would be my final question, but I want to ask one more. When is that process likely to conclude?