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Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 20 March 2026
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Displaying 4779 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 10 March 2026

Kenneth Gibson

But not this.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 10 March 2026

Kenneth Gibson

Thank you very much for that. No colleagues have indicated that they wish to ask questions. We therefore turn to agenda item 4, which involves formal consideration of the motion on the instrument. I invite the minister to move motion S6M-20861.

Motion moved,

That the Finance and Public Administration Committee recommends that the Scottish Landfill Tax (Standard Rate and Lower Rate) Order 2026 (SSI 2026/97) be approved.—[Ivan McKee]

Motion agreed to.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Spending Review and Infrastructure Delivery Pipeline 2026

Meeting date: 10 March 2026

Kenneth Gibson

I fully appreciate that, but an issue that I have discussed with the Scottish Fiscal Commission and others is the fact that the gross domestic product deflator is a ludicrous way to assess capital costs, given that it bears no relation to the actual costs. Mention has been made of modest declines in capital, but, when we look at what can be delivered on the ground, we realise that the declines are a lot greater than that. It is important that we have a realistic measure of capital costs.

An issue of great frustration to many members is the cost of the procurement process and the associated bureaucracy, and, in particular, the vast cost of consultancy fees and so on. As I mentioned last week, I remember Donald Cameron, who is now Lord Cameron, raising the fact that some £18 million had been spent on consultancy fees in relation to the Rest and Be Thankful. For God’s sake, it is just a road that is exposed to a lot of landslides. Why did it cost £18 million for consultants to work out a way of sorting that out? Ordinary people—laypeople—cannot comprehend why those fees are so vast. Such expenditure detracts from the delivery of projects, and it seems to lead to dithering and delay, with the result that a project that could be done in a year or two takes three years or five years.

What can be done to de-bureaucratise the delivery of such projects? In my view, the process for many of the projects that we are talking about seems to be a dripping roast for consultants.

09:15

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Spending Review and Infrastructure Delivery Pipeline 2026

Meeting date: 10 March 2026

Kenneth Gibson

Hold on a second. If £18 million is spent on consultancy fees, even if an astronomical sum of £1,000 a day is paid for consultancy, do 18,000 days of work go into that for one road?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Spending Review and Infrastructure Delivery Pipeline 2026

Meeting date: 10 March 2026

Kenneth Gibson

Come on. Things must be able to be done more efficiently, more effectively and more timeously.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Spending Review and Infrastructure Delivery Pipeline 2026

Meeting date: 10 March 2026

Kenneth Gibson

John Mason may recall that I was a councillor six years before him and we opposed PFI or PPP from the start. There was none of this, “Oh, we realised years later that it wisnae great”—it was opposed from the start by the SNP, Labour and the Liberal Democrats. Certainly, the SNP opposed it throughout. That is historical fact.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Spending Review and Infrastructure Delivery Pipeline 2026

Meeting date: 10 March 2026

Kenneth Gibson

Not of the Liam Byrne variety.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Spending Review and Infrastructure Delivery Pipeline 2026

Meeting date: 10 March 2026

Kenneth Gibson

At the most recent Scottish Parliament information centre seminar that I spoke at, there was a discussion of front-line services. I was asked what front-line services are, and I said that the public would consider no one in that room to have a front-line service job—indeed, we could say the same thing about this room today.

Is “front-line service” not an unhelpful term to use? Does the Scottish Government have a definition of front-line services? People think of nurses and doctors as being front-line workers but, of course, they could not work effectively without everybody from porters and pharmacists to human resources professionals and the maintenance teams that back them up.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Scottish Spending Review and Infrastructure Delivery Pipeline 2026

Meeting date: 10 March 2026

Kenneth Gibson

I think that Liz Smith has a bottle of champagne and a bouquet of flowers. [Interruption.] Oh, she forgot them anyway—never mind.

We will have a five-minute break and there will be a changeover of witnesses.

10:35

Meeting suspended.

10:41

On resuming—

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Public Administration in the Scottish Government

Meeting date: 10 March 2026

Kenneth Gibson

That is not quite the same as the optimal size. As you will appreciate, that is essentially the Government saying that it wants a 20 per cent reduction. Do you have a view on what the optimal size is? If I assume that you achieve the target, we could be in a situation in which the Government of the day—whatever its colour—says, “You’ve achieved a 20 per cent reduction over the past five years, so maybe we should look at a reduction of X percentage over the next five years,” or whatever the target happens to be. Is there a size of workforce at which you think that you can optimise delivery of the services that you provide for us all?