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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 19 December 2025
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Displaying 4037 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Okay. Behavioural change is another issue that is very important in relation to future Scottish Government policy and thinking. As you will know, the Scottish Fiscal Commission told us that it believes that, although the higher additional rate of tax would raise £30 million on paper, it would raise only £3 million in reality because of behavioural change. The Fiscal Commission emphasises that that change would be more people not working as hard, as opposed to people with more than one address moving their tax affairs south of the border.

However, in your response you said that the Scottish Government had considered the issue and that the

“study found no evidence of significant behaviour change, including cross-border migration, as a result of our move to a more progressive tax system.”

How does that sit with the comments of the Scottish Fiscal Commission, which says that 90 per cent of that income from a simple additional penny will be lost? That is a very dramatic loss for a small increase, yet the Scottish Government seems to be saying that it does not see that happening.

In previous meetings with the committee, you have suggested that the Scottish Government is very aware of behaviour change. Where are we on the issue? It clearly needs further exploration.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

Kenneth Gibson

I am just wondering if there is any way—

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

Kenneth Gibson

I just wanted to clarify that.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

Kenneth Gibson

That will be next year.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Of course.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Thank you for that brief opening statement. As is traditional, I will start with a few questions; we will then open out the session to colleagues around the table. My first question relates to one that I posed in the chamber, to which you responded on Thursday, about our estimated overspend. When you gave evidence three weeks ago, I believe that the overspend was between £200 million and £500 million. Work has obviously progressed to reduce it to around £100 million. First, how have you managed to achieve that reduction? Secondly, what steps are being taken to try and eliminate it altogether between now and the end of the financial year?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

Kenneth Gibson

I was really keen to get that on the record. I know we talk about always having to balance the budget. People might think that we can just kick things into next year.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Colleagues may wish to pursue that further.

The committee has raised a number of issues about taxation. For example, we asked when the Scottish Government plans to publish a discussion paper about tax and spending choices. The response that we got was that the rationale for that document has changed and the United Kingdom Government’s mini budget has gradually been unwound. What is the rationale? Is it because of volatility at the moment, or are there other factors to consider?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

Kenneth Gibson

ACS is also a social enterprise. The cross-party group on the circular economy is going to visit it. I asked the company about ex-offenders and was told that the level of productivity is excellent. The company would not mind at all if the whole workforce was made up of ex-offenders because they are able to deliver the product that is required.

I have a question about the private finance initiative and public-private partnerships, which placed a significant annual financial burden on the Scottish Government when it came into office in 2007. I understand that interest rates going up has had a significant impact. What impact are increased payments having on the Scottish Government and local authorities?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2023-24

Meeting date: 7 February 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Before the rise in inflation, my local authority had to pay about £16 million or £17 million for schools that were completed in 2007. Those payments go up to 2037, but I understand that they have increased significantly because many of them are tied into current interest rates as opposed to rates that are fixed over a period of time. So that we can consider the implications of that across the public sector, any information on the issue would be helpful.