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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 4 November 2025
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Displaying 3846 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

That is a bit cruel, really.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Yes, driving a tractor is better than working with a pitchfork.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

You said that

“Public investment is merely a fraction of private sector investment”

and

“The UK is therefore reliant on capital from abroad, with the low productivity of the country also making investments less attractive.”

Because we have not got enough capital investment, it deters the people we need to bring in more capital investment.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Mr Sousa, you have talked about, in terms of capital, the difference between different types of infrastructure spend. I remember back in 2008 when we had the crash, everyone was talking about the gearing effect of certain capital projects relative to others. In other words, if you invest in one type of capital, you get more return than from others.

Your submission talks about

“road and rail connections, which are canonical examples”,

and notes that

“Public transport in particular has a high return.”

You also went on to talk about how UK businesses have

“lowered investment skills over time”,

which I am sure others will pick up on.

Given that there will almost certainly be a capital funding gap in the forthcoming year and beyond, where should we prioritise capital for the maximum amount of economic return?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Well, there are still issues, but it is not quite how it was. Back in the day, my dad’s sister died of scarlet fever, but I do not think that many people die of that now in Scotland.

Okay, the late Craig Hoy. [Laughter.]

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

We continue our evidence session with a round-table discussion. I welcome Michael Kellet, director of strategy, governance and performance, Public Health Scotland; David Livey—who I think we may have met once or twice before—policy and public affairs manager, Scottish Council for Voluntary Organisations; Dave Moxham, deputy general secretary, Scottish Trades Union Congress; Mike Brown, treasurer, Social Work Scotland; and Ian McCall, policy and campaigns officer, Walking Scotland. I welcome you all and thank you for your written submissions.

We have about 90 minutes for this session. If witnesses wish to be brought into the discussion at any point, please indicate to the clerks and I will call you—I will not be asking each of you questions in turn.

I will start with an opening question to Dave Moxham. Do not act surprised, Dave; I told you two minutes ago we were going to start with you.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

We will start with a question to Dave Moxham, and anyone who wants to comment on what he says can let me know. After that, we will move around the table and cover a number of areas. There are some areas that people have made strong comments on in their submissions. I am sure that those issues will come up naturally but, if they do not, I will go to someone and say, “In your submission you said such and such” and we will take it from there.

In more or less the first paragraph of its submission, the STUC says:

“Scotland needs more workers. While migration is a reserved matter, the Scottish Government should be engaging with the UK Government, pushing for the devolution of powers relating to migration and employment law and for Scottish Government involvement in important cross-border institutions and decision-making bodies to ensure Scotland’s specific population challenges are heard at a UK level.”

To be fair, I think that the Scottish Government has tried to do a lot in that regard. I am not sure that UK Governments, past and present, have been too keen on migration. Can you talk about that issue, which is a very important issue at the current time?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Thank you.

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

Do you not want to talk about the issues of migration and taxation, which Dave Moxham just mentioned?

Finance and Public Administration Committee [Draft]

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2026-27

Meeting date: 9 September 2025

Kenneth Gibson

That would be helpful—unless you want to mention any of them now.