Skip to main content
Loading…

Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

Criathragan Hide all filters

Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 18 December 2025
Select which types of business to include


Select level of detail in results

Displaying 4037 contributions

|

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Thank you for that helpful opening statement. I have scribbled down quite a few things to ask on the basis of your statement; I hope that I can read my writing when I try to ask my questions.

The first thing that I will ask about is the consultation on part 2 of the bill. Why did the Scottish Government not consult on those provisions? That caused some irritation among our witnesses last week from the Law Society of Scotland, the Chartered Institute of Taxation and the Institute of Chartered Accountants in Scotland.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

You have been talking to HMRC for two years, so I do not understand why you do not have that information.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

You talked about the Smith commission, but the committee has already said that it does not support the assignment of VAT because it would provide no advantage whatsoever to Scotland and trying to establish it would be a bureaucratic mishmash.

It is not just about devolving for the sake of devolving—there have to be some advantages. One advantage could be, as the Scottish Environment Protection Agency suggested,

“the use of secondary, recycled aggregates in Scotland as part of our shift towards a more circular economy”.

However, if you are not doing anything differently, there are no advantages. I note that you are saying that one day, in the far, distant future, the rate might be £2.05 as opposed to the £2.03 that it will be from April. I am sorry for being sarcastic, but the Government’s uber-cautious approach to the issue is underwhelming, to put it mildly.

I will move on—

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I have other questions, but I want to open up the discussion to colleagues round the table, rather than holding the floor. I will bring in John Mason first.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I was going to ask you about that at the end, but as you are giving me a nudge and a wink to ask about it now, I suppose that I may as well. Last week’s witnesses called for a finance bill, as have Liz Smith and I and other committee members for a number of years, because that would provide an opportunity to make changes across areas for which we have responsibility and, as you know, the Government is working on six new taxes.

Such a system would make it a lot easier to locate where provisions are and would provide a timetable for people to feed into the process in order to make representations about what can be influenced or included in that year’s finance bill. That seems to me and other committee members to be a fairly logical step forward.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I suppose that, given what you have said, the sooner we start, the better.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

It is to do with section 130 of the Finance Act 2008, which has to do with debt management and is what HMRC uses. Basically, it is about the offsetting of debts and where that applies.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

We appreciate that. Do you want to make any further points before we wind up the session, minister?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I take the word “prudent” as meaning inertia. A company that is investing millions of pounds in buying or innovating with regard to the latest technology to process and recycle, in the belief that the Scottish Government will move forward to a circular economy, will not see any evidence that that is the case. I am seeing evidence of a bureaucratic change whereby a tax is being devolved without any seeming ambition to make it any different from the tax in the rest of the UK. There will then be a wrestle with the UK over the impact on our block grant and so on and what that means for Scotland. It seems to me to be completely underwhelming.

The business and regulatory impact assessment refers to introducing

“a replacement tax that retains the fundamental structure of UKAL”—

that is, the UK aggregates levy—

“while being tailored to Scotland’s needs.”

I am just not seeing anything that is tailored to Scotland’s needs. Who undertook that BRIA?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Aggregates Tax and Devolved Taxes Administration (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 19 March 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Is HMRC just not telling you? Why do you not have that data? Surely you have asked. It must have some information on that within a margin of 5 or 10 per cent. I would have thought that it is pretty straightforward.