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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 25 May 2025
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Displaying 3259 contributions

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Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2024-25

Meeting date: 9 January 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Just before he answers, I add that I have been threatening to bring Howard in because Audit Scotland has made the interesting point that, since the Scottish Parliament was re-established in 1999, the number of people working in the public sector has grown from 150,000 to 245,000 full-time employees and there has been a huge increase in pay, with the deals that were agreed in 2022-23 and 2023-24 being £1.7 billion more than was planned. The Auditor General has said:

“significant reform of the public sector—including its workforce—is needed to protect services over the long term”.

He went on to state:

“public services in their current shape are not affordable”.

There are a number of areas for us to discuss. Do you want to respond to Michelle Thomson first, Howard, and we will see where we go from there?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2024-25

Meeting date: 9 January 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Your name is right in front of me.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2024-25

Meeting date: 9 January 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I have been calling Michelle “Gillian” for the past two years, inexplicably. I just do these things. I do apologise, Richard.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2024-25

Meeting date: 9 January 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Interestingly, there has been a significant increase in the budget for digital. John Mason is next.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2024-25

Meeting date: 9 January 2024

Kenneth Gibson

Yes, and we have a UK budget coming in March. We do not know how that will impact.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2024-25

Meeting date: 9 January 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I see Keir Greenaway playing with his fingers—when I see you doing that, Keir, I keep thinking that you are going to put up your hand to make a contribution.

There does not seem to be any great enthusiasm to say anything, so, if that is the case, we will—[Interruption.] I see that Shona Struthers wants to come in. On you go, Shona.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2024-25

Meeting date: 9 January 2024

Kenneth Gibson

I will let John Mason ask a question in a minute.

One of the issues is the process: we get the autumn statement and then we have three weeks for the Scottish Government to produce a budget. The Scottish Government has to wait for the Scottish Fiscal Commission to come out with its forecasts, because that is what the budget is based on. The SFC comes up with the forecasts and says how much is going to be available. The Government then starts divvying up the pot. It also has to haggle with Ross Greer and his colleagues, because there is a two-party agreement at that stage, and then it has to put it all together. That is the background and, to a large extent because of that, one of the things that the budget document lacks—as it always does—is the reasons why the decisions have been made. I do not think that it would improve transparency if we were to get the equivalent of “War and Peace” on every budget line—it would be more than the 125 pages that it is already—but it would be useful if we had more of an explanation in the document about why one decision was being made, as opposed to a different decision. That is something that we can press for.

Time is against us, so I want our guests to have a wee think about any final comment that they want to make after John Mason has asked his question and before we wind up the session.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2024-25

Meeting date: 9 January 2024

Kenneth Gibson

For example, if you had an underspend on paper of £150 million, that is less than one day’s revenue for the Scottish Government; it is a nonsense. That is the money that you have available in order to move things forward. It is always 100 per cent committed, in my understanding.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2024-25 and Economic and Fiscal Forecasts

Meeting date: 20 December 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Yes. You said that resource funding will rise by 8 per cent by 2028-29 but, in the figures on page 5, in the second line, there seems to be a 4.2 per cent rise rather than an 8 per cent rise. I just wonder why that is, or have I got it wrong?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2024-25 and Economic and Fiscal Forecasts

Meeting date: 20 December 2023

Kenneth Gibson

Before you ask another question, John, I see that Claire Murdoch wants to come in.