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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 7 May 2025
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Displaying 1039 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 June 2023

Angela Constance

I am happy to answer any specific question on any matters that have been raised directly with the committee.

Criminal Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 June 2023

Angela Constance

The core issue is about the binding effect of arbitration. We legislated for almost-binding arbitration in the 2016 act. That is the closest that we could get to binding the Parliament and ministers—that is a really high threshold for binding the Government. I hope that that is of considerable reassurance both to the committee and to the staff associations, all of which have been consulted on the regulations and the constitution.

It is important to stress that, practically, the PNBS will operate on three levels. First, we have the regulations. Secondly, the constitution has been published—has been shared publicly—and is rooted in the regulations. However, there is a third layer below that, in the day-to-day operating guide. That is being developed and it will be for all parties in the PNBS to come to an agreement about its processes.

Criminal Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 June 2023

Angela Constance

Are you talking about the correspondence of 24 May?

Criminal Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 June 2023

Angela Constance

It was published in May 2023.

Criminal Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 June 2023

Angela Constance

It is important to recognise that the Government wants to act in good faith. Although, as I said, there has been no need for arbitration procedures to be used in the past, I consider protecting on-going arbitration arrangements to be a sign of strength, not of weakness. Bearing it in mind that police officers cannot withdraw their labour, it is imperative that they have access to other mechanisms.

As I said, under the 2016 act, the Parliament agreed that the Government would have to “take all reasonable steps” to implement any arbitration agreement. To put that into more human speak, we would seek, in the spirit of fairness, to fulfil any obligations that are placed on the Government when it comes to arbitration.

The wording in the legislation is “all reasonable steps”. It is not uncommon for such wording to appear in legislation. The Government accepts that arbitration arrangements should be in place and that we would act in good faith and seek to implement any arbitration decisions, other than in extreme and exceptional circumstances. I do not think that our position has changed over successive terms of office.

Criminal Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 June 2023

Angela Constance

Good morning.

Criminal Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 June 2023

Angela Constance

No. The constitution is what has been published.

Criminal Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 June 2023

Angela Constance

I have tried to distinguish between the regulations and the constitution, and then the guide on the day-to-day operability and working practices of the PNBS.

I will ask officials to give some practical examples of what will be in the guide, which might help.

Criminal Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 June 2023

Angela Constance

There is no change to what police officers can or cannot do, whether that be withdrawing good will or whatever. We know that they cannot withdraw their labour, because they are office-holders, not employees.

The agreement that we have reached, as set out in the regulations, is very much about continuity with a previous arrangement. Obviously, there is public scrutiny of the regulations and the constitution, and that certainly gives ministers an opportunity to say that they will participate in any process as fair actors. We as a Government are committed to collective pay bargaining and the principles of fair work.

In many ways, this is a bit of a legacy agreement. The nuts and bolts were agreed in 2016, but now that there will be a new chair, we need to move to a Scotland-only arrangement. Otherwise, I will have to ask the Prime Minister to appoint the new chair. We have been using a UK-wide system that has been operating only in Scotland for some years—

Criminal Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 7 June 2023

Angela Constance

I met with the Scottish Police Federation. I would have to check the date in my diary, but it was not that long ago—it may have been three weeks ago. Those issues were not raised with me. I have seen the letter that was sent to the committee on 24 May. I did not see it on that date, but you would not expect me to be privy to correspondence that is sent to a committee.