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Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 17 September 2025
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Displaying 2847 contributions

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Education, Children and Young People Committee

Additional Support for Learning Inquiry

Meeting date: 20 March 2024

Sue Webber

Thank you, cabinet secretary. We now move to questions from members. I call Liam Kerr to kick off.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Additional Support for Learning Inquiry

Meeting date: 20 March 2024

Sue Webber

That was quite a succinct response. I hope that Michelle Thomson is online now, as she will ask the next questions.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Additional Support for Learning Inquiry

Meeting date: 20 March 2024

Sue Webber

Cabinet secretary, you said that no one would disagree with the presumption of mainstreaming and the drive for inclusion, and you mentioned the tribunal. However, in written evidence to the committee, the tribunal challenged that view, saying that

“An inclusive education for those who have additional support needs would be best served by the removal of a bias in favour of a particular type of education”—

on the assumption that that is mainstreaming—and that

“A bias of this type is the reverse of an inclusive approach.”

What are your thoughts on that?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Additional Support for Learning Inquiry

Meeting date: 20 March 2024

Sue Webber

The ASN tribunal also argued that the presumption of mainstreaming should not be grounds for refusing a placing request. Equally, however, Matthew Cavanagh, who is from a specialist school, stated that a specialist setting would often best suit a child. Much of my casework on the topic is about placing requests, when the local authorities that are making the decisions have not even met or engaged with the young person. What are your thoughts on that?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Additional Support for Learning Inquiry

Meeting date: 20 March 2024

Sue Webber

If parents and carers are aware of what is happening with the developments in those schools, there might be more understanding of the placing.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Additional Support for Learning Inquiry

Meeting date: 20 March 2024

Sue Webber

Some schools are repurposing spaces, creating decompression zones or making walls less rattly and crackly to improve sound. Schools can make those sorts of adaptations. That is the avenue that I am probing, cabinet secretary.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Additional Support for Learning Inquiry

Meeting date: 20 March 2024

Sue Webber

Pam Duncan-Glancy has a supplementary question.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Additional Support for Learning Inquiry

Meeting date: 20 March 2024

Sue Webber

I thank the cabinet secretary and her officials for their time. That concludes the public part of our proceedings, and the committee will now move into private to consider the final item on the agenda.

11:14 Meeting continued in private until 12:06.  

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Additional Support for Learning Inquiry

Meeting date: 13 March 2024

Sue Webber

Megan Farr, do you have something to add?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Additional Support for Learning Inquiry

Meeting date: 13 March 2024

Sue Webber

Before I bring in other members, I will unashamedly highlight Currie community high school, which is next door to Woodlands specialist school. My old headteacher, Eric Melvin, had the inspiration to put those schools close together so that sharing could take place.

Is anyone aware of any other such examples? As we hear evidence from the rest of the panel, there will be other opportunities to comment on how that collaborative approach might work for parents, pupils and staff. I will bring in Megan Farr, and then we will come to David Mackay and Chloe Minto.