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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 11 December 2025
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Displaying 2081 contributions

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Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee [Draft]

Freedom of Information Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 27 November 2025

Martin Whitfield

Agenda item 2 is an evidence-taking session on the Freedom of Information Reform (Scotland) Bill. I welcome Katy Clark, the member in charge of the bill. She is supported today by Carole Ewart, the director of the Campaign for Freedom of Information in Scotland. Thank you both for joining us. I will hand over to you, Katy, to make some opening remarks.

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee [Draft]

Freedom of Information Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 27 November 2025

Martin Whitfield

Your view is that an email address should be sufficient and it does not need to be an email address and postal address—is that right?

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee [Draft]

Freedom of Information Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 27 November 2025

Martin Whitfield

That, in essence, would also be your thesis in response to the point that new designations would cost money. When there is a new designation, much of the work of the Information Commissioner will already have been done, unless the individual, authority or entity wants to spend a fortune. Designation will be presented as a step, and a newly designated body should not fear it, because, if it is a well-run organisation, it can comply easily.

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee [Draft]

Freedom of Information Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 27 November 2025

Martin Whitfield

I apologise for interrupting you, Carole. I am conscious of the time, because we have a lot to get through. The session is for the member. A substantial amount of what you have talked about has been submitted in evidence, so we have heard it. I am conscious that we want to hear from the member in charge of the bill rather than consider evidence that we have already heard, because, if the bill progresses, we must also establish the amount of room that we have to make changes. However, thank you for that contribution.

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee [Draft]

Freedom of Information Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 27 November 2025

Martin Whitfield

Sorry, Ruth. I did not mean to cut across you.

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee [Draft]

Freedom of Information Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 27 November 2025

Martin Whitfield

Obviously, standing orders cannot direct legislation. However, the motion that would be debated in the Parliament could articulate the date when the designation would take effect. Is that the vehicle by which you see the designation occurring, rather than it being made by the minister and subsequently reviewed in the debate? Do you see Parliament having that role in debating the motion as the vehicle of designation?

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee [Draft]

Freedom of Information Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 27 November 2025

Martin Whitfield

That is helpful.

Let us turn to the financial memorandum and the duty to publish. As you have articulated, including just now, the duty to publish is a reframing of an existing obligation—it is where we want to get to. Therefore, you have suggested that the duty is, in effect, cost neutral, because we are just moving on. The Government does not agree with you. What is your evidence for your position? What is your view? Does proactive publication simply reframe an existing duty, which therefore already encompasses it? Alternatively, given the evidence that we have heard about the changes that might be required, particularly in councils, do you think that the Government might have a point in saying that the provision could require resource?

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee [Draft]

Freedom of Information Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 27 November 2025

Martin Whitfield

In your introduction, you made the point that this is actually a technical bill rather than a bill that covers massively new ground. You have said that the financial memorandum is accurate in that you are reframing an existing obligation. However, you also talked about the bill trying to achieve cultural change, and we all know that cultural change is incredibly difficult to achieve and invariably comes with costs. What is your view on that specific issue?

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee [Draft]

Freedom of Information Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 27 November 2025

Martin Whitfield

One of the other criticisms that have been levelled at the provision is that, although it would hardly ever be used, local authorities would now potentially have to store information for ever and a day, because they would be concerned that, at some point in the future, someone would come along and say, “This person deliberately got rid of it.” How would you answer that?

Standards, Procedures and Public Appointments Committee [Draft]

Freedom of Information Reform (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 27 November 2025

Martin Whitfield

That is fine. Thank you.

I thank Carole Ewart and Katy Clark for attending this morning. If thoughts or views come to mind, as sometimes happens the second you step outside of the door, you know where the clerks are in order to reach us, and vice versa, should we have any questions further to our deliberations, I hope that you do not mind our reaching out to you for answers.

10:06 Meeting continued in private until 10:41.