Skip to main content
Loading…

Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

Criathragan Hide all filters

Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 30 October 2025
Select which types of business to include


Select level of detail in results

Displaying 895 contributions

|

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment of UNCRC Compatibility Duty) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 October 2025

Tess White

Good morning, cabinet secretary. I have two questions. First, you talked yesterday to some of the witnesses who came before the committee. When we heard from stakeholders, they were fairly unanimous that the bill will create conflict between parents and children. Such conflict could be one of the bill’s unintended consequences. It is almost as though the state is stepping in when—as, I think, you said yourself—headteachers manage that nuance all the time. Why should the state step in when it is not a problem for headteachers?

10:30  

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment of UNCRC Compatibility Duty) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 October 2025

Tess White

That is not the point. The point is that nobody can see why we are doing this. In the past few weeks, we have heard from witnesses such as the Church of Scotland, the Scottish Catholic Education Service and the Scottish Human Rights Commission, and we are all scratching our heads about this.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment of UNCRC Compatibility Duty) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 October 2025

Tess White

Will you be giving extra support to headteachers to manage the situation when conflicts arise and students have to be given additional support?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment of UNCRC Compatibility Duty) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 October 2025

Tess White

Cabinet secretary, the committee is spending a huge amount of time—and you are here today—looking at a technicality. The sample size is so small, and we are doing a huge piece of work on a bill that is going through Parliament when none of the witnesses have said that there is a problem. It just seems as though we are using a sledgehammer to crack a nut.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment of UNCRC Compatibility Duty) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 October 2025

Tess White

As a committee, we will go through stage 1 of the bill and produce a report, so we will have to make decisions. To date—last week and today—we have not heard anybody say that they are in favour of the bill. We are hearing words such as “weeds” and “holes”, which is alarming.

I will ask my question on part 2 of the bill. What are your views on the Scottish Government’s reasoning for the further exemption to the compatibility duty? I ask Gina Wilson to respond first, then Juliet Harris and Gavin Yates, and I will bring in Louise Church last.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment of UNCRC Compatibility Duty) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 October 2025

Tess White

It is part of the issue when you want more reporting. It would take a lawyer to unravel what you have just said. However, when there is a conflict between a parent and a child, they will have to go through the legal system and find a legal aid solicitor, which is almost impossible. You have confirmed my concerns, because you want more reporting, but the Convention of Scottish Local Authorities says that no inventory of what exists is in place. The bill would be bad lawmaking. I think that I have reached capacity on that one.

Juliet, would you like to answer the question about stage 2 in a very simple way that we can understand?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment of UNCRC Compatibility Duty) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 October 2025

Tess White

Do you have any views on the approach being taken in part 2 of the bill? We heard some really strong views on that last week and we have heard some strong views this morning, too. Do you have any additional thoughts on that? Susan, I am looking at you.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment of UNCRC Compatibility Duty) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 October 2025

Tess White

My question is on part 2 of the bill, but I will come back to Juliet Harris before I ask that. I do not know whether our role is to mend holes in webs, and the hodgepodge of law making is a huge problem. This is one of the questions that we explored last week. Why should we not recognise that this is a hodgepodge? We should not start off here; we should wait for the human rights bill and incorporate it all in that. You are nodding. Will you address that point before I ask for your views on part 2 of the bill?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment of UNCRC Compatibility Duty) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 October 2025

Tess White

I go back to something that Gavin Yates said about access to justice and the bill creating more harm. One area that the committee is exploring is the huge issues with legal aid, mainly for women who are suffering from domestic abuse. What will happen if we enter this realm as well and implement the bill, with its issues of the balance of rights between the parent and the child, and the child having to be a certain age and have the capacity to access legal aid? There is no access to legal aid for those children. Gavin, I go back to your point about the bill causing more harm than good if there is no access to justice.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee [Draft]

Children (Withdrawal from Religious Education and Amendment of UNCRC Compatibility Duty) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 7 October 2025

Tess White

Louise, that was a brilliant summary. Thank you for that.