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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 5 August 2025
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Displaying 1072 contributions

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Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Social Security Scotland

Meeting date: 16 January 2025

Paul O'Kane

That is what I was keen to explore next. The Cabinet Secretary for Social Justice spoke last week about moving from the discovery phase of the programme to day-to-day business. We know that policy innovations come along—for example, the announcement in the budget about the two-child limit and the delivery of a payment with regard to that. You are closing one programme and that has come along, so how do you intend to prepare for that? What do you think the challenges will be in trying to move to the business as usual space?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Social Security Scotland

Meeting date: 16 January 2025

Paul O'Kane

On building the system, we know that there has been a lot of debate and conversation in the past few weeks about the need for DWP to transfer data and the interaction between the two Governments. What is your role in that and what do you require to be prepared to build the system that will ultimately deliver whatever the policy intent is?

09:45  

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Social Security Scotland

Meeting date: 16 January 2025

Paul O'Kane

On the point about building capability, horizon scanning and preparedness, the Government policy on the two-child limit was sent to the Scottish Fiscal Commission a week and a day before the budget was introduced. When was Social Security Scotland made aware that it might have to deliver that innovation?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Social Security Scotland

Meeting date: 16 January 2025

Paul O'Kane

Good morning. David Wallace’s introduction was very helpful in setting some of the context. We are interested, first, in the operational challenges of taking on the remaining functions of the current programme. In particular, what progress has been made on reducing the risk score of bringing the project to its closure?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Scottish Human Rights Commission

Meeting date: 14 January 2025

Paul O'Kane

Good morning. I want to follow up on the commissioner piece that we have been discussing. The committee will seek to influence colleagues and help to shape some of what is looked at within that, and it is important that we give the various stakeholders the opportunity to do that. My sense, from the discussion, is that we want to take a broader look beyond the mechanics of commissioners and the financial implications. Angela O’Hagan’s points about the root-and-branch approach are important.

We have heard—because we have a duty to consider commissioners’ proposals, which often come before us—that access to justice is missing. We have touched on that already today. Do you want to see your piece of work on access to justice for everyone form the basis of conversations and recommendations within that wider piece of work? Do you want to highlight, on the record, anything specific in that at this stage?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Scottish Human Rights Commission

Meeting date: 14 January 2025

Paul O'Kane

That is helpful to the committee in thinking about how we engage. I am grateful.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 9 January 2025

Paul O'Kane

I appreciate what you are saying about the move to a steady state. We know that the main benefit that still needs to be devolved is employment injury assistance, and we have just touched on the Government’s intention to mitigate the two-child limit. We had this discussion before the Christmas break, but that decision was taken a week and a day before the budget was announced—you may want to correct me if I am wrong about that. To what extent has that decision been factored in, given the potential delay that could be caused to the closure of the programme? Was planning done prior to that decision being made? Were projections considered on the impact of the decision on the wider programme?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 9 January 2025

Paul O'Kane

I have a question about future changes. As you rightly point out, it is for any Government to decide what to do when more mainstream social security becomes devolved. I noted that the Deputy First Minister made some public comments yesterday about the two-child limit, suggesting that the reason why it had not previously been considered was that the DWP was not willing to give information.

Regarding long-term planning for social security, we have had a discussion about costs and we know that there will be structures for that. Has the cabinet secretary been planning that for some time? Has she considered the preparation of some of that? That seems to be what the Deputy First Minister was alluding to yesterday. Within that, has the cabinet secretary previously asked the DWP for those powers?

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 9 January 2025

Paul O'Kane

The point is that the Labour Government has been in power for six months but the two-child limit existed for many years before that. We also know that the Scottish child payment came in in 2021, so my question to you is whether you asked for those powers at any point.

Social Justice and Social Security Committee

Budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 9 January 2025

Paul O'Kane

Good morning, cabinet secretary and officials. I will move on to the theme of planning and administration of social security in Scotland.

The gateway review in February 2024 concluded that

“successful delivery appears feasible but significant issues ... exist requiring management attention”.

In your view, have those issues been addressed? What progress has been made?