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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 6 May 2025
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Displaying 1673 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 April 2024

Russell Findlay

I have a past job as a journalist, and I spoke with our witnesses, Stephanie Bonner, Bill Johnstone and Magdalene Robertson.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 April 2024

Russell Findlay

Hi Stephanie. How are you doing? I pay tribute to you for coming here today. None of us can truly imagine what you have been through and it is admirable that you want to do this in order to help other families.

Do not worry too much about the numbered questions. If it is okay, I would like to ask a general question to start with about what the experience has done to your faith in policing and to that of all the supporters that you have here today.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 April 2024

Russell Findlay

Do you think that that faith can be repaired?

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 April 2024

Russell Findlay

We spoke in 2020 when I was working at STV news. One of the issues that you raised then was that the initial catastrophic mistakes made by the police might have been due to what was deemed to be postcode policing. Assumptions were made, and there was no going back once the police had made their decisions.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 April 2024

Russell Findlay

They have the resources and the arguments and they know the system.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 April 2024

Russell Findlay

Making a complaint as a member of the public about something that has happened is one thing, but you were a grieving mother complaining about something that is absolutely unimaginable to most people. There was no real compassion, except at the outset when the officers who came to you were respectful and helpful. I think the phrase that you used for what happened after that was, “a hellish merry-go-round,” which seems to sum it up.

11:15  

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 April 2024

Russell Findlay

We do not expect you to know what the bill does. We do not yet know that, because we have not looked at it properly. However, I assume that you would agree, in general terms, that we need to pass a law that changes the police complaints process. That is absolutely necessary.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 April 2024

Russell Findlay

The same goes for what its disclosure might be to the Crown Office, although, in this case, it did not choose to disclose. My question is about the legislation. Could there be a mechanism whereby if there was full transparency around those submissions to the PIRC and to the Crown from Police Scotland, that would build public confidence that at least the complainer knew that the powers that be—the PIRC and the Crown—were being told something that was reflective of what they were saying?

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 April 2024

Russell Findlay

One proposal in the bill is that the PIRC should have access to Police Scotland’s systems, which seems perfectly sensible. That would open things up if there are attempts to withhold certain information, but that is opposed by the Scottish Police Federation.

I will make a quick point. You described going to the PIRC, which said that it could not look at a particular set of circumstances because they were of a criminal nature, but when you went to Police Scotland with the same information, it deemed them not to be criminal, and if you did not accept that, it would not look at them.

Criminal Justice Committee

Police (Ethics, Conduct and Scrutiny) (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 17 April 2024

Russell Findlay

I have previously spoken with Maggie about what she is attempting to deal with.