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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 3 August 2025
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Displaying 885 contributions

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Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Regulation of Legal Services (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 November 2023

Kaukab Stewart

On behalf of the committee, I thank you for giving up your time this morning. We appreciate how busy you are. Your evidence has been valuable.

I suspend the meeting briefly to allow for a change of witnesses.

10:49 Meeting suspended.  

10:55 On resuming—  

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Regulation of Legal Services (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 November 2023

Kaukab Stewart

I bring in Paul O’Kane.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Regulation of Legal Services (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 November 2023

Kaukab Stewart

Yes, as is the usual experience.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Regulation of Legal Services (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 November 2023

Kaukab Stewart

That is interesting. Earlier this morning, the committee heard about the situation in which a citizen might want to sue the Government. However, what about the consumer—the person on the street—who might want to sue their lawyer because they have not received a good service? What I have heard, albeit anecdotally—but also through constituency work, because people know that the committee is dealing with this so they come to talk to me—is that some people have not had good experiences. They feel that they are up against a whole system and that that system looks after itself. Did you speak to individuals or look at such casework? Can you give us an example of that?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Regulation of Legal Services (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 November 2023

Kaukab Stewart

Thank you for that. The diagrams were exceptionally helpful and I say that not just as a teacher who loves diagrams. [Laughter.] They do illustrate things.

I will ask for clarification on a few points. The diagram of the current regulatory framework says that the

“Scottish ministers have duty to consult Lord President”.

What does that involve? Is that a legal duty to consult and if so, on what, for example? How do you know that ministers have consulted? Does that transfer into decisions? I am interested in what power ministers have at the moment.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Regulation of Legal Services (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 November 2023

Kaukab Stewart

Thank you very much. I will kick off the questions; my colleagues will then come in.

Lady Dorrian, you mentioned the role of the Lord President. I want to give you an opportunity to unpick that a little bit. Can you give us some practical examples of the role of the Lord President and the implications of the bill for what the Lord President would or would not be able to do?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Regulation of Legal Services (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 November 2023

Kaukab Stewart

The minister has indicated that amendments will be lodged that should allay some of the concerns that have been robustly raised, but we do not know what those amendments will be. In that wriggle room, would either of you like to give me an indication of what those amendments could be that would address your concerns?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Regulation of Legal Services (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 November 2023

Kaukab Stewart

Fair enough.

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Regulation of Legal Services (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 28 November 2023

Kaukab Stewart

I have been listening really carefully and would like to come back on a few points. I would like to generate more discussion about the consumer’s perspective, because we have taken lots of evidence on the lawyer’s point of view and every other view. Can you give us some insight into how the consumer’s point of view informed your report, whether your views have developed on that and whether the consumer is served well by the bill in its current state?

Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee

Regulation of Legal Services (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 21 November 2023

Kaukab Stewart

Please do.