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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 28 August 2025
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Displaying 3543 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland’s Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

We will draw the session to a close. Thank you both for coming. It has been a very helpful session. We will have a short suspension to allow for a change of witnesses.

10:35 Meeting suspended.  

10:38 On resuming—  

Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland’s Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

Our next panel of witnesses is Wendy Sinclair-Gieben, His Majesty’s chief inspector of prisons, HM Inspectorate of Prisons for Scotland, who joins us remotely; Phil Fairlie, who is deputy general secretary of the Prison Officers Association Scotland; Paula Arnold, who is governor of HM Prison and Young Offenders Institution Stirling and vice chair of the Prison Governors Association (Scotland); and Ian Bryce, who is legal vice chair of the Parole Board for Scotland. Thank you all for joining us and for agreeing to give evidence. Wendy, I hope that your connection will stick with us and will let you come in.

I will allow around 60 to 70 minutes for this evidence session. To get the discussion under way, I begin with a similar question to the one that I asked of the first panel. As you all know, the Cabinet Secretary for Justice and Home Affairs proposes the release of up to 550 prisoners earlier than anticipated, because of an emergency situation, and she proposes other measures later, via primary legislation, to cover long-term prisoners. I will bring in Wendy Sinclair-Gieben first, then I will move along the panel from my left to my right. What are your views on the proposals? Will they be enough, or—particularly in the context of the longer-term approach to the prison population—should an alternative way forward be found?

Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland’s Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

Wendy, do you want to come in on that?

Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland’s Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

Do you feel that there is scope for that whole policy process to be reviewed?

Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland’s Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

I have a follow-up question on that. You might be aware of some correspondence that the committee has received from the cabinet secretary, outlining a proposed plan for the release process. In the letter, she refers to prescribed organisations that would have a role in supporting victims in relation to the release of prisoners. Victim Support Scotland is one of those organisations. Are you reassured that that is sufficient? From what you said just a moment ago, it sounds as though you have concerns about whether that will be adequate.

Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland’s Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

Thank you for that. I will bring in Lynsey Smith now.

Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland’s Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

My next question is on that issue, after which I will bring in other members. You have had the Covid experience, so to speak, and, as you said, there has been positive learning from that, we hope. Do you feel that social work services across Scotland—criminal justice social work in particular—are ready or have had time to prepare for the proposed release?

Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland’s Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

We are just about up to time, but I have a couple of members who want to come back in. Are the witnesses okay to stay for another five minutes or so? Thank you. I will let Katy Clark and then Russell Findlay come back in.

10:30  

Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland’s Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

That is very interesting.

Criminal Justice Committee

Emergency Release of Prisoners and Other Key Challenges in Scotland’s Prisons

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Audrey Nicoll

I want to bring in other members. I will come back to you if there is time, because I know that that is an important issue.

Next, we have questions from Sharon Dowey and then Pauline McNeill.