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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 13 May 2025
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Displaying 1235 contributions

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Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Housing (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 10 September 2024

Paul McLennan

Yes, you are right: that is an issue in relation to adaptations. One aspect is about ensuring that local authorities are more proactively aware of the adaptations that are required. There will be cases in which a person who is coming home from hospital needs adaptations to be made. There is guidance to encourage landlords to consider that and to move as quickly as possible. I do not see a situation in which a landlord would say no, unless there are real technical issues, such as in relation to changes involving heavy lifting gear. There is support and guidance in order to try to provide changes as quickly as we possibly can, which is really important.

I touched on category 1 and category 2 changes. It depends—if the adaptation involves a couple of handrails, I would not imagine that that would be an issue. If it involved lifting gear going in, for example, that might impact on the property, so I imagine that there would be discussions at an early stage about the technical stuff. However, there is support and guidance to encourage landlords to be as flexible as possible in that period, particularly in respect of the issues that you raise. I am sure that most landlords would be sympathetic, but it would depend on the level of adaptation.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Housing (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 10 September 2024

Paul McLennan

Marie Curie has mentioned that point in recent discussions. I expect to get some correspondence about that matter, if it has not already come in. That suggestion is something that we could consider.

I have also had discussions with MND Scotland and Marie Curie about getting in place a process to deal with adaptations, because sometimes a situation is life threatening. In some cases, such as with cancer or motor neurone disease, things can happen very quickly. Therefore, it is important to get in place a structure to ensure that matters are dealt with. For example, we have been speaking to the Association of Local Authority Chief Housing Officers about local authorities having a process to ensure that those people are prioritised. For the PRS sector, again, we should have a process in place for people who are terminally ill.

I fully expect that MND Scotland and Marie Curie will send in something in writing, and we would look at that sympathetically, because we are trying to get people in as comfortable a position as possible. As I said, both MND Scotland and Marie Curie have raised the matter in previous discussions, but we have not received anything yet, as far as I am aware.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Housing (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 10 September 2024

Paul McLennan

I will talk about the specifics of the bill. It is important to recognise the private rented sector—I will touch on MMR and BTR in a wee second.

First, the private rented sector is important. We have had discussions with the City of Edinburgh Council and Glasgow City Council and it is fair to say both councils know that they need to work more closely with the PRS in a strategic approach. I would like and would encourage deeper discussions on the role of the PRS in Edinburgh, Glasgow and other parts of Scotland and for that to be part of local housing strategies, and we have written to local authorities about that.

The second consideration is how we ensure that the sector grows, and that needs to be recognised in the bill. The bill tries to strike a balance between what is proposed for rent control and the need to bring in investment. Investment might look like a landlord who currently owns one property buying another; or someone who owns five or 10 properties looking at doubling up. I have said to the SAL that I want to see people coming back into the sector. The latest data shows that numbers have slightly increased. Anecdotally, having spoken to the councils in Edinburgh and Glasgow, I know that they have found that landlords who own single properties are selling up but they are selling those properties to landlords who have a bigger portfolio, such as five, 10 or 15 properties. The number of landlords is probably decreasing and the number of properties in the sector is slightly increasing. At the moment, there is a slight lag, but that is the data that is coming through on that. That is recognised.

There are a couple of other things. If a local authority says that it has a requirement for rent controls and comes to ministers, there is also the opportunity to review the matter then. If there is a change in circumstance, for example, rent controls can be revoked. It is not that they are in place for five years and cannot move. There is an opportunity to discuss them and to have flexibility.

One question is whether we can give that clarity through rent controls. If they are a local authority’s responsibility, there is flexibility to change them if circumstances change. However, we have to balance how we get into MMR and BTR.

Obviously, we recognise that MMR—housing associations—is an important part of the sector. In Glasgow, for example, because the council is a non-stockholding authority, RSLs have a really important part in how MMR stock is developed. Again, we have listened to what Glasgow City Council is saying and we will consider that. It is the same with Edinburgh. There are a number of housing models, not just RSLs. The question is how they deliver.

There is that wider discussion. Local housing allowance obviously has a part to play in the matter. There have been discussions with the UK Government previously and there are discussions now about what the role of LHA is. That is an important part of the matter.

We are trying to encourage BTR. We have churn in properties in Edinburgh and Glasgow. That is turning round. We also need to recognise not just the role of BTR in housing—it is important because it increases supply—but its role in bringing investment into Scotland and in construction jobs, as well as the gross value added that it brings into Scotland.

We have picked up on the importance of those things in the discussions about BTR and MMR that we have had with stakeholders and with individual landlords through the Scottish Association of Landlords, for example. On the other hand, we have to make sure that rent controls are there to protect people who need them. The challenge for me with the bill is in striking the right balance. I think that we are moving in the right direction, and I appreciate the point that you make about it being a framework bill.

I am happy to come back to the convener to discuss amendments and any changes in detail when those come through, but it is important to get the right balance. It is a tough ask in a complex market. It is not that one size fits all, but that is what we hope to achieve. I am happy to come back to the committee at the appropriate stage to discuss those matters.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Housing (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 10 September 2024

Paul McLennan

When I spoke to the Social Justice and Social Security Committee about homelessness prevention, we touched on the fact that we contacted local authorities to ask about costs and they gave their best estimates at that time. Colleagues and local authorities have had detailed discussions about what implementation will look like and when the measures will be phased in. That is the important part. The focus of that is not to have additional resource implications for local authorities—I think that Ms Gosal mentioned that. Our discussions with local authorities include asking what additional resources would be required, including for data collection, and discussions are on-going. The financial memorandum provides an estimate, and an updated memorandum will be provided at the end of stage 2.

It is safe to say that discussions are on-going. We have to ensure that the resource is in place around homelessness prevention measures and gathering data on rent controls, because we cannot put any additional pressures on local authorities. As I said, there are on-going discussions, and at stage 2 there will be an updated financial memorandum to reflect that. I do not know whether any colleagues want to mention anything in relation to resource discussions.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Housing (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 10 September 2024

Paul McLennan

I will try to be brief, convener. There are a couple of points. One is that funding was announced last week, from which Edinburgh will benefit significantly. We have been working with the City of Edinburgh Council on its practices around void properties in terms of what it needs to do. The council thinks that it is making progress, so we have tried to help it. In addition, there is an upcoming round table with utility companies—housing conveners raised the issue of utility companies with us in a meeting—and local authorities on how we can improve the practice in that regard. Utility companies need to be doing more and working more quickly in that regard. That work is already under way. The housing investment task force is also looking at different funding models around accommodation and so on.

I am happy to pick that up in the discussions that we have planned. If there is anything that you think we could consider as an amendment to the bill, I am happy to discuss that, but other things are already going on to provide support on void properties. As you recognise, the issue is incredibly important in Edinburgh specifically, and I am happy to take that offline with you.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Housing (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 10 September 2024

Paul McLennan

I think that you are right, Mr Briggs, looking at the matter legally. The point that you make will be looked at sympathetically, and there have already been broader discussions about the process for adaptations and succession, as Charlotte McHaffie mentioned.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Housing (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 10 September 2024

Paul McLennan

That would need to be set out, based on the broader situation. There are specific issues behind the rent increases in Edinburgh and Glasgow. We have talked about the opportunities around the freeport and renewables hubs in the Highlands. If construction workers go into those areas, how will that increase rents? That might be for the short term, but we need to take cognisance of it. For example, if workers are being attracted to the freeport area—Highland Council has estimated that there could be 25,000—we have to ensure that we are building houses at a level that meets that demand. We are having discussions with Highland Council about that and on the renewables hubs to consider the opportunities for accommodating construction workers and the legacy housing opportunities behind that. We need to take cognisance of other local impacts that there might be.

The flexibility allows us to look at controls in different parts of Scotland and the reasons behind that, but that has to be backed up by data.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Housing (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 10 September 2024

Paul McLennan

I will bring in Yvette Sheppard on the specifics. The key thing is that local authorities will come forward with what they think, and we will look at that. Yvette might want to touch a wee bit on the broader consultation.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Housing (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 10 September 2024

Paul McLennan

There are a number of ways in which that is being done. One is by having discussions; there are discussions among officials on that, which Yvette Sheppard can highlight.

Secondly, there are discussions with local authorities. I have talked to them about the resource issue, so the issue has been raised and that is important. The financial memorandum sets out an initial estimate of the costs. As we develop the bill, the financial memorandum will need to demonstrate the resources that are required.

Our discussions with local authorities are not just about what the data collection is about; they are also about the resource that is required to do it. That information will come in an updated financial memorandum. The discussions that we are having are looking at the resource for local authorities, because the point that you make is incredibly important: we cannot put additional pressures on local authorities without the resource. The discussions cover what resource is required to deliver the data that we are looking for. That has been raised by local authorities, and we are asking them to be more specific about that. The initial discussions are about estimates.

Local Government, Housing and Planning Committee

Housing (Scotland) Bill: Stage 1

Meeting date: 10 September 2024

Paul McLennan

I touched on that in my opening remarks—there are a number of key aspects, and I will try to keep my comments to a minimum.

One aim is to encourage growth in the sector, which is incredibly important. The sector plays an important part in the all-tenure approach that I have taken, and which has been discussed by stakeholders in previous sessions. It is about getting the balance right between the rent controls, which we have touched on and will go on to discuss, and the investment opportunities. That is one of the first aspects.

Another key aim is to ensure that we have the best-quality homes in the private rented sector and a flexible system for both tenants and landlords. That is a difficult balance to strike, but I think that the bill achieves it with what is being proposed.

Another key area is to look at how we tackle not just child poverty but fuel poverty and homelessness.

There are other aspects; for example, we need to move towards net zero, so how do we help landlords to do so? That is not part of the bill, but it is part of the on-going discussion with landlords.

Another aim is to ensure that tenants and landlords understand their rights. Again, that is about trying to strike the right balance, and I think that the bill does that.

That is a very quick run-through but, with the measures that are being proposed, we have tried to get the balance and flexibility right all the way through the bill.