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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 21 August 2025
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Displaying 1691 contributions

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Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

That is helpful. I will play that back, so that I am clear on that. Then I will bring in Mark MacPherson.

I think that we are using the two terms differently. You are pointing out a straight alignment, potentially with local businesses, in which course provision is predicated on what they might assess as their needs at that time. I am making a wider point about—this is where I want clarification—how being fleet of foot in course provision can bring economic benefit. Take net zero and some of the skills that we might need for that. Businesses, particularly small and medium-sized enterprises, might not have necessarily understood yet what they need, but we might know that at an academic level. Are you making that distinction? Do you understand the economic benefit?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

I ask David Belsey to reflect on that and on the wider impact of the cuts. What is your thinking, from an infrastructure perspective, on how we can get to a sustainable college estate, bearing in mind the cuts that I have set out?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

I think that we could all agree with that. Obviously, things might change after the general election and any new incoming Government might move away from the 20 per cent real-terms cut to capital investment. However, either way, given the chronic issue with UK public finances, which applies across the board, I would appreciate your thoughts on infrastructure investment planning that is built into a sustainable college estate. What are some of the key areas that it would be important to plan out? What would you draw out from your perspective, accepting and understanding the difficulties?

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

There is a lovely parallel between risks and opportunity there. Mary Senior, I offer you the chance to have the last comment.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

That leads on to my next question. You have set out clearly some of the risks and their significance. Given the risks that you have highlighted, what can we do to start to rebalance the position? Obviously, that needs to be staged over a period of time.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

What you just said does not in any way reflect the fact that there is a projected 20 per cent real-terms cut in the capital budget. To be clear, the capital budget is given to the Scottish Government by the UK Government, and the Scottish Government has only a very limited capacity—an extremely limited capacity—to increase that budget, so it cannot allocate more money to college infrastructure than is available. In the light of that situation, what are your reflections? The Scottish Government cannot take money from revenue—from day-to-day expenditure—and put it into capital. That is illegal; it is not allowed to do that.

The Scottish Government can spend only what it is given so, when there are significant cuts, there is nowhere else for it to go and priority calls need to be made. As I pointed out, Audit Scotland has shown that, over the most recent two years, the Scottish Government has provided an increase in capital expenditure. I am trying to understand whether, in this very real situation, there are any silver bullets in order to deliver a sustainable college estate. It is not as simple as pushing out plans—I think that that is what Mark MacPherson was alluding to. We will have to do less, because we have less.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Pre-budget Scrutiny 2025-26

Meeting date: 5 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

I am trying to understand what social considerations colleges should make. I think that, in your earlier remarks, you highlighted that colleges should consider their contribution to society when they are considering course provision.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scotland’s Commissioner Landscape

Meeting date: 4 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

How interested will you be in the findings in our final report?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scotland’s Commissioner Landscape

Meeting date: 4 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

What did you make of the SPCB’s consideration of costs? Off the top of my head, I think that the cost of the commissioners is about 12 per cent, which is top-sliced off the SPCB’s budget. We do not have an estimate for what the figure would be if all the new proposed commissioners went through. However, given that it would be roughly double, we could say that that would take the cost of commissioners up to 24 per cent of the SPCB’s entire budget. What are your reflections on that? Do you think that that is acceptable or sustainable?

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Scotland’s Commissioner Landscape

Meeting date: 4 June 2024

Michelle Thomson

To what, then, do you attribute the cultural underpinning?

I do not have the exact quote in front of me, but when a former MSP who had originally proposed the establishment of a commission gave evidence to us, they were less enthusiastic about the idea now than they were when they proposed it. They suggested that the establishment of a commission can perhaps be about creating a sense of activity to give the illusion of progress. That speaks to me of a culture of being seen to be doing something, rather than one of a relentless focus on outcomes.

What are your reflections on the culture of the creation of commissioners, in the context, perhaps, of the numerous other public bodies that we have?