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Chamber and committees

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 5 May 2025
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Displaying 1515 contributions

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Economy and Fair Work Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 26 January 2022

Michelle Thomson

Good morning, minister. I am happy to see that progress is being made. One of the good aspects of Covid is that it has accelerated something that was intended to happen anyway.

I have a general question. How confident are you that the organisational capacity and capability from an information technology perspective is in place, with particular reference to safety and security? You may have already tested that. We are talking about extremely important documents that go back a long way, and hacking is a concern for any organisation.

Economy and Fair Work Committee

Scotland’s Supply Chains

Meeting date: 26 January 2022

Michelle Thomson

Yes. You have accurately depicted the wider environment in regard to rules—you mentioned the WTO and so on—but I am asking about the general concept of mandation to effect change in the market, including with regard to the net zero aspect.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Implementation Plan Progress and Updated Complaints Procedure

Meeting date: 25 January 2022

Michelle Thomson

I will press you on this issue a little. We know that loss of control over situations will be regarded by many as further abuse. Although I fully accept what you are saying from the point of view of Government, ethics—to go back to that term—would require equal consideration of both sides.

I would also make the point that, in a circumstance such as that, the evidence tells us that there can often be a loss of cognitive capacity because emotion is running high. There is also a risk to the Scottish Government that, in taking the initial evidence where that might be the case, without necessarily saying, “You do realise that we could make a police report,” the chance of a successful or consequentialist ethical outcome could be diminished.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Implementation Plan Progress and Updated Complaints Procedure

Meeting date: 25 January 2022

Michelle Thomson

And their expertise, as well, of course. Thank you.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Implementation Plan Progress and Updated Complaints Procedure

Meeting date: 25 January 2022

Michelle Thomson

Within the process and the culture that we have talked about, what specific consideration have you given to the complexity of having special advisers as civil servants? It is a slightly special challenge, because special advisers come in through a political route and then become civil servants. Obviously, civil servants have different obligations. It seems to me that that is worthy of additional consideration and reflection. What have you done in that respect?

11:15  

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Implementation Plan Progress and Updated Complaints Procedure

Meeting date: 25 January 2022

Michelle Thomson

Okay—this is my last question. Again, it is a wee technical thing. Within the process, how much active consideration have you given to managing the weighting of evidence?

We know that contemporaneous, third-party evidence carries much more weight than evidence that is brought out at a later period, but it is quite a complex and technical area in terms of risk. Have you given that active consideration? It is quite complex, and it does skew results.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Implementation Plan Progress and Updated Complaints Procedure

Meeting date: 25 January 2022

Michelle Thomson

To go back to the issue of culture, culture is the hardest thing to change in any organisation. It is well understood in a programme management context that the process normally takes years and involves values-based frameworks, staff training and all the rest of it. The issue has been well covered, but I have not yet heard you reflect on the issue of changing culture in a hierarchical organisation, where there are particular considerations in relation to the balance of power.

I realise that that is a slightly technical question, but I would like to hear your reflections on culture change in a situation in which there is a strict hierarchy, as exists in the civil service.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Implementation Plan Progress and Updated Complaints Procedure

Meeting date: 25 January 2022

Michelle Thomson

I suppose that my issue is about agency for victims, to be specific.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Implementation Plan Progress and Updated Complaints Procedure

Meeting date: 25 January 2022

Michelle Thomson

I fully understand the position that you are giving from a Government point of view, but, personally, I think that it would be beneficial to sit down and look at it from the exact opposite point of view, as well.

Finance and Public Administration Committee

Implementation Plan Progress and Updated Complaints Procedure

Meeting date: 25 January 2022

Michelle Thomson

I have four questions, all on slightly different areas, and I will add an extra one, because I want to go back to a point that John Mason made about making a police report.

I realise that the nature of the issue depends on the circumstances, but where it concerns sexual impropriety or worse, I am very clear that people make a complaint because they want to be heard, and not because they necessarily will take the steps that will result in the matter ending up in court. What active consideration have you given to the possibility that the Government’s approach could have a cooling effect on complainants, which is completely the opposite of the intention?