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I thank the panel for coming along. Richy Edwards’s witness statement in particular was extremely powerful and really helpful. We cannot overestimate the power of lived experience in making and shaping law.

In determining how all this might fit with the criminal law in Scotland, you recommended criminalisation, which you have spoken about. How do you see that working in practice in relation to parents, medical professionals and faith leaders?

That is really helpful—thank you.

I would like to add to my initial question. Dr Crowther, you spoke earlier about how we are still very much in a society where being cisgendered and heteronormative is seen as the default setting for human beings. It is quite hard for people to break through that narrative. Richy Edwards spoke about there being a ripple effect, which harms not only the individual concerned but the whole of society. If conversion practices were to be made a criminal offence, would it be helpful in changing such mindsets so that there could be good, positive ripple effects?

That is helpful—thank you.

That is really helpful—thank you.

Thank you for bringing the petition to the committee. I am excited about being able to talk about a sign language. It is really important to note that, as you stressed, BSL is different from Makaton. I was brought up bilingual, so to speak, because my dad was deaf. I was brought up to be quite fluent in BSL, so I know the difference. BSL is a full and complete language in itself, whereas Makaton has a sign per word for someone who may already understand English or spoken language.

I have seen the communication difficulties for people who use sign language in any form and I know how incredibly frustrating they can be. There are different signs for different words, which is why it is important to have an interpreter who knows how someone uses the signs. There is some crossover with the idea of understanding. I completely get where you are coming from: communication is vitally important.

It was interesting that you brought up the signs for who, what, where and when. I always add why and how. We have who, what, where, when, why and how. When someone can make the signs for those words, as I have just done, they can begin to open up and really communicate with another individual.

The point about communication is key to the evidence that you are giving today, particularly when it comes to the justice system, because in that case we are talking about people who are already in a vulnerable position. Statistically, they are more likely to be taken advantage of, which is why it is so important that we get the communication right.

I am saying all this because I want you to know that I really understand where you are coming from. I have seen somebody with a learning difficulty start to use Makaton and it made a massive difference in their life. I could see it in their demeanour and how they could express themselves. Just to be able to show that they wanted something to eat, for example, made a massive difference.

We are focusing on communication in the justice system. Are there any other areas that you think should be opened up through use of Makaton or do you want to focus only on the justice aspect?

That is really helpful. What you have said makes me think that it would be good to keep some documentation of the signs that a person uses. We had a wee document passed to us today that shows us some signs. I was just thinking that I sign my name by pointing to my cheek, because I have a dimple, but those things are quite individual even in families or households. We also have regional sign language—I talk mostly Doric BSL—so I completely get your point, and that has opened up another aspect.

Will the member take an intervention?

Consensus is great, and it is fantastic to work on a cross-party basis in any kind of collaboration, particularly when it comes to human rights. However, I can never work with anyone who would vote against the rights of LGBT people.

International human rights day marks the adoption of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights by the United Nations General Assembly in 1948, as the minister said. The Universal Declaration of Human Rights is a milestone document that proclaims inalienable rights that everyone as a human being is entitled to.

It is really sad to see the political attacks in here. We are accused of talking about the Tories and the UK Government. We have to say that, unfortunately, we have another Government that has influence over the Scottish Parliament—but not for long. I have heard the SNP mentioned many times. I appreciate the ad, but that is not what we are here to talk about.

The theme for this year is dignity, freedom and justice for all. Unfortunately, I recognise that, for some, today is yet another day of torment, torture and denial of the very rights that we celebrate. It is shameful that there are people around the world, including in Scotland, who seek to deny others those inalienable rights.

The motion rightly applauds those who bravely speak truth to power at great personal cost, wherever they are in the world. We are aware of recent examples of people who have placed their lives in danger in doing that so that others may have a tomorrow full of basic human rights and protections. For example, who could not have been impacted by the activism and boldness of Iranian women? I applaud the courage and determination of protesters in Iran and elsewhere who are challenging police brutality and the deep-seated misogyny of their legal systems.

One of the protesters in Iran is Mahnaz Parakand, who is an Iranian lawyer and activist. She recently stated why she does what she does. That could easily apply to what the day really represents. The statement is as bold as it is beautiful. She said:

“I suffer from seeing other people’s discrimination as much as those individuals themselves suffer from it. It is our responsibility to clear the way for the recognition of the humanity of all human beings, regardless of their gender, sexual orientation, beliefs, ethnicity ... and to respect all human beings and human rights. I consider the struggle for human rights and justice not as a duty, but as a part of my identity.”

That has to be our struggle, our journey and our identity.

As the First Minister stated to women in Iran who are fighting for basic human rights, “We stand with you.” Scotland should be a home for all, committed to delivering a shared vision in which everyone can have a life of human dignity. It should be a nation in which human rights are respected and protected. I am pleased to see that the Scottish Government remains committed to supporting the rights of women and girls on an international stage as well as at home.

The Human Rights Act 1998 brought convention rights home by enabling people to raise human rights issues in Scottish courts. That legislation also places a duty on public bodies to comply with human rights in everything that they do. However, the act is under threat, as the Tories at Westminster have proposals to replace it with a new Bill of Rights Bill that would weaken the protections in the Human Rights Act 1998 and put the UK in breach of its international obligations.

By contrast, work is well under way in Scotland to incorporate into law the human rights that are contained in a number of other international human rights treaties that cover economic, social, cultural and environmental rights and stronger protections for the rights of women, disabled people, trans people, black and ethnic minority people, older persons and children. I agree with the Scottish Human Rights Commission that

“the UK Government’s Bill of Rights Bill threatens to damage Scotland’s progress in developing a human rights culture”

and to

“undermine the UK’s international reputation”—

or, at least, what is left of it.

Scotland has ambitions to be a global leader in human rights with integrity and an identity that is rooted in compassion, empathy and understanding. I stand with everyone who is battling every day for their basic human rights and challenge us all to be better allies to the people who desperately need it.

I thank Rachael Hamilton for taking my intervention. Has she noted the Scottish Human Rights Commission’s comments on the Bill of Rights Bill?

Good morning. I will follow on from what we have just been discussing. Jim Farish talked about people understanding their rights, and Eilidh Dickson talked about people generally knowing what human rights are and how they interact. In his opening statement, Ian Duddy, said that training is one of the commission’s remits. What does that training look like? Who does it apply to? For the benefit of the committee, how do you roll out that training?