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Good morning everyone. I am a Scottish Conservative and Unionist Party member of the Scottish Parliament for West Scotland.

I take what you have just said, Allan, as a positive that the committee has been doing good work.

Last week’s meeting was very interactive, and I found it very productive—I am sure that other colleagues have talked about it, too. We enjoyed listening to people’s real-life experiences as well as those of people who are working on the ground. All committees should definitely go out and hear people’s real-life experiences; after all, we just sit in this building, making laws and policy. Although there is consultation, last week’s meeting showed how important it is to hear about real life.

Something that was highlighted last week and which has been talked about many times today is the issue of accountability. One particular point was that the Scottish Government gives out money for programmes; the people leading those programmes might not be qualified or have the experience, but they are given large sums of money, with no accountability and transparency. I have heard today about a lack of transparency; about the fact that it is very difficult to follow the money and find out how it is allocated and spent; and about a process failure and a lack of accountability. Who is accountable when it comes to finding out whether progress is being made over time and where the money from Government to councils is being used?

The scenario that I have set out is one that people told us about last week. They said that, when the money that is given out goes down the chain, the project managers who are put in place do not have the experience. Nonetheless, they are given these very large sums of money to run those programmes. Allan, you mentioned accountability from Government to council, and it would be good to hear your views on how accountability in programmes can improve. What more can the committee do? We have heard about the good work that we are already doing, but could we do more? Could we ask the minister and cabinet secretary the right questions when they are here later? What would you want us to ask them when it comes to accountability from the top right down to the bottom so that we ensure that that golden thread is there?

Minister, before I turn to the cabinet secretary, I want to touch on what you have said. It is good to hear about the key three outcomes. “Policy”, “strategy” and “outcomes” are great words in a document, but what are you doing on the ground to ensure that women are not placed at a disadvantage, especially when it comes to employment? What is happening on the ground out there? How are we helping those women get into employment? What are we doing around care, housing and so on to do that? That work will not be in a silo; a number of departments will have to work with you on that. I am sure that women out there who are listening to this will want to hear what the Scottish Government is doing to help them get back into—or stay in—work.

Thanks for that response. You gave a lot of information there, but I want to go back to that last point. Although we welcome a lot of powers being given to local authorities, it is important for you to give an answer to Emma Congreve directly but also to everybody who is listening—and I am sorry to be so direct, but it is important—because this is taxpayers’ money. At our workshops last week and this week, we heard a lot about the different areas where people think that money spent could be more transparent and accountable. When it comes to human rights budgeting, who is accountable for ensuring that the money goes down that golden thread? Is it leadership, or is it people all the way down?

I thank the witnesses for all the information that they have provided so far. My question links in very nicely.

Last week, we heard from former participants in the whole family equality project about the importance of not working in silos. Employability often goes hand in hand with many of the areas that we have heard about today, such as housing, education and transport. I remember asking the Minister for Equalities, in February, about the need to move away from the current portfolio-based budget modelling towards a more performance-orientated approach. The minister agreed that departments must work together to achieve the best possible outcomes.

Today, however, we have heard about a lack of connections. We have heard that such considerations do not feed into wider budgets, that some areas of human rights are understood while some are not understood, that how resources are allocated is not followed through, and that more connections and greater clarity are needed. Furthermore, people cannot follow the money to find out what is being spent. Those are just some of the issues that have been raised.

Could you expand on those comments in relation to the cross-portfolio approach? Do you believe that the Scottish Government is doing a good job at taking a cross-portfolio approach in human rights budgeting?

I will certainly put that to the Government.

Cabinet secretary, I have a question. You may have been listening when I said to Emma Congreve that I would ask about something that came up with the first witness panel. It is good to hear that progress is being made and you have acknowledged that there are gaps and cracks that must be looked at and addressed, but I find it shocking for any Government nowadays to have no accountability.

I am not saying that the Government has no direct accountability—of course it does—but we hear organisations and witnesses asking about that. We heard earlier that large sums of money leave the Scottish Government, which means that sufficient evaluation is needed, but Emma told us earlier that she does not know who is accountable. Money goes out from the Scottish Government and into local authorities and may go on from there into the private sector or into charitable or other organisations. Where does the accountability lie? Where is the leadership and transparency?

That was going to be my last question. Will you follow up to see where the comments have come from and why they are being made, from top to bottom, to see what is happening, where it is happening and where the cracks are appearing?

My question might have been answered, so you might be lucky, but it would be good to hear a little bit more about it.

Last week, we had a private meeting at which people from the whole family equality project spoke about money being wasted year after year because no multiyear budgeting was in place. The organisation said that, sometimes, when money is given out to a programme, it takes a whole year to get familiar with the programme, set it up and work at it and then, before you know it, in the second year, the money disappears.

It was highlighted that we should ask you about that, cabinet secretary. Do you agree that we need to have multiyear budget settlements? I think that I heard you say earlier that you are implementing multiyear budgeting. Is that right? Could you tell me a little more about that?

Thank you very much.