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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 14 September 2025
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Displaying 3579 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee (Draft)

Substance Misuse in Prisons

Meeting date: 3 September 2025

Audrey Nicoll

We move on to our second panel of the morning. I am pleased to welcome Dr Craig Sayers, clinical lead for prison healthcare at NHS Forth Valley and for the national prison care network; Dr Lesley Graham, a retired public health doctor and founding member of Scottish Health Action on Alcohol Problems; and Dr Catriona Connell from the University of Stirling. Welcome to you all, and thank you very much for your attendance. Thank you also to those witnesses who have provided written submissions.

We are looking to spend around 80 minutes on this evidence session. I will get things going with my usual opening question. I will perhaps come to Dr Sayers first, and I will then move across to Dr Graham and Dr Connell.

We have heard a lot of evidence throughout this inquiry, and we are keenly aware that the primary focus of our evidence has been on the use of drugs in prisons. It has been less to do with the use of alcohol or some other complex issues around co-dependency, the use of alcohol and its impact, particularly in the justice system. Could you perhaps set the scene by setting out whether illicit alcohol in prisons is indeed an issue in Scotland? Is there adequate and consistent screening, and is there early identification of alcohol use disorders at admission? What support and service provision is available in prisons and, more broadly, in the community?

That is quite a big question. I will bring in Dr Sayers first to kick things off.

Criminal Justice Committee (Draft)

Substance Misuse in Prisons

Meeting date: 3 September 2025

Audrey Nicoll

Under our next item of business, we will continue our inquiry into the harm caused by substance use in Scottish prisons. Today’s session gives us the opportunity to take evidence from two panels of witnesses with experience of rehabilitation, throughcare and post-release support. I am very pleased to welcome: Gillian Reilly, head of service for the alcohol and drug partnership executive at NHS Scotland; Haydn Pasi, head of the national voluntary throughcare partnership at Sacro; Marianna Marquardt, policy and research officer at Scottish Families Affected by Alcohol and Drugs; and Hamish Robertson, director of data and insights at the Wise Group. You are all very welcome, and I thank you for joining us this morning.

I refer members to papers 1 and 2, and I thank those witnesses who have provided written submissions. I intend to allow up to 80 minutes for this session.

As ever, I will begin with an opening question. The focus of today’s session is, as I said, rehabilitation, throughcare and post-release support, however, I will open up with a general question just to set the scene. I will come to Hamish first and then work across the panel, asking you for your thoughts and comments.

To what extent is substance use in prison driven by supply-side issues—for example, the availability of drugs, illicit medication trading and the lucrative market associated with drug supply in prison—set against the demand-side issues such as boredom, trauma and self-medication? Again, to what extent is substance use in prison driven by that demand and supply effect, and what further steps can be taken to address the supply side specifically?

Criminal Justice Committee (Draft)

Substance Misuse in Prisons

Meeting date: 3 September 2025

Audrey Nicoll

Thank you for that. I am sure that we will come back to how to tackle the demand side of the issue.

Criminal Justice Committee (Draft)

Substance Misuse in Prisons

Meeting date: 3 September 2025

Audrey Nicoll

It is interesting that you refer to the complexities around co-dependency—for example, where somebody comes into prison using alcohol and how that bears out in a shift towards using other substances. I am sure that we will come back to that.

Does Pauline McNeill want to come in at this point?

Criminal Justice Committee (Draft)

Substance Misuse in Prisons

Meeting date: 3 September 2025

Audrey Nicoll

Thank you for that. It was interesting to hear that, because I am not aware of it coming up before.

Criminal Justice Committee (Draft)

Substance Misuse in Prisons

Meeting date: 3 September 2025

Audrey Nicoll

We are aware that the SPS has recently moved to a focused day model, so we will be looking for a wee bit more detail from it on that.

Criminal Justice Committee (Draft)

Substance Misuse in Prisons

Meeting date: 3 September 2025

Audrey Nicoll

I was away to pull us back into the prison estate, but that was very interesting to hear, Ms Reilly.

Ben Macpherson and Pauline McNeill have a couple of supplementary questions. Ben can come in first, and I will then hand over to Pauline. After that, I will bring in Rona Mackay.

Criminal Justice Committee (Draft)

Substance Misuse in Prisons

Meeting date: 3 September 2025

Audrey Nicoll

We are just about to come up to time, but I am keen for the committee to cover a few more issues. If the witnesses are okay to carry on for maybe another five to 10 minutes, that would be helpful for us. With that, I bring in Katy Clark.

Criminal Justice Committee (Draft)

Substance Misuse in Prisons

Meeting date: 3 September 2025

Audrey Nicoll

Throughout our inquiry, we have discussed medication assisted treatment standards in the context of the prison estate. I am interested in the views of the witnesses on how well MAT standards are being implemented in prisons. Is it likely that the Scottish Prison Service will meet its anticipated implementation date of April next year? If not, what barriers are being faced? I will bring in Gillian Reilly first.

Criminal Justice Committee (Draft)

Substance Misuse in Prisons

Meeting date: 3 September 2025

Audrey Nicoll

Thank you—that is very helpful. As no one else wants to come in, I will bring in Fulton MacGregor.