Skip to main content
Loading…

Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

Criathragan Hide all filters

Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 5 May 2021
  6. Current session: 12 May 2021 to 20 June 2025
Select which types of business to include


Select level of detail in results

Displaying 3231 contributions

|

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of Ferguson Marine Port Glasgow (Holdings) Limited”

Meeting date: 5 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Thank you.

I turn to some of the governance issues that are highlighted. One thing that has taken some time to come to fruition is a framework agreement between the Scottish Government and FMPG. The most recent iteration of that was published in, I think, October 2024. It was an attempt to codify people’s roles and responsibilities and to ensure that people understood that FMPG, while operating as a shipyard and competing in the commercial sector, is nonetheless a non-departmental public body and is expected to comply with things such as the Scottish public finance manual.

Mr Irwin, that framework agreement sets out clearly that your responsibilities as the accountable officer include the requirements of propriety and good financial management. There are questions about what happened during the financial year 2023-24 at FMPG under your watch. How do you respond to that?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of Ferguson Marine Port Glasgow (Holdings) Limited”

Meeting date: 5 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Okay. Let me look, then, at the role of the strategic commercial assets division of the Scottish Government. According to the framework agreement, the division has responsibility,

“including financial and operational and when appropriate intervening”.

When I read the minutes of the board meetings—although no minutes of board meetings have appeared on the FMPG website since 30 May 2024, which is quite remarkable—I saw that the board meetings are attended by members of the Scottish Government’s strategic commercial assets division. Do they not have a responsibility for the failures of governance and internal control?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of Ferguson Marine Port Glasgow (Holdings) Limited”

Meeting date: 5 February 2025

Richard Leonard

I am anxious to understand this. If it is set down in black and white in a written agreement, either there has been negligence or the agreement has not been followed; alternatively, there has been a misrepresentation of what happens on the ground.

Mr Cook wants to come in.

09:45  

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of Ferguson Marine Port Glasgow (Holdings) Limited”

Meeting date: 5 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Okay. We will get into the detail of some of those questions shortly.

Can I just ask another question, slightly cheekily, perhaps? I should declare my trade union interests. The framework agreement talks about a

“Trade Union Representative being present and contributing to relevant items at Board meetings”.

Why is it not relevant for a trade union to have a view on issues that come up in the board minutes, such as health and safety, environment and security, or the intake of apprentices? Why is it not rightly in the domain of the trade unions to be involved in those discussions? Are the company’s financial position, the business plan and progress with vessels 801 and 802 not of concern to the trade unions and workforce in the yard?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of Ferguson Marine Port Glasgow (Holdings) Limited”

Meeting date: 5 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Is the trade union representative in the room for the whole of the board meeting or are they brought in at a certain point?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of Ferguson Marine Port Glasgow (Holdings) Limited”

Meeting date: 5 February 2025

Richard Leonard

That is Mr Logan.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of Ferguson Marine Port Glasgow (Holdings) Limited”

Meeting date: 5 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Do you mean 7 February?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of Ferguson Marine Port Glasgow (Holdings) Limited”

Meeting date: 5 February 2025

Richard Leonard

We are up against the clock, but the deputy convener has some important final questions to put to you. Over to you, Jamie.

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of Ferguson Marine Port Glasgow (Holdings) Limited”

Meeting date: 5 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Does that include clearance from the cabinet secretary?

Public Audit Committee

Section 22 Report: “The 2023/24 audit of Ferguson Marine Port Glasgow (Holdings) Limited”

Meeting date: 5 February 2025

Richard Leonard

Okay. “Yes” from the civil service is the right answer. However, it would be helpful if you could go back and clarify for us what was known and when, because that is quite important.

In a newspaper report Mr Tydeman said that he had no idea that he was going to be sacked—that it was almost a summary dismissal. If there was due process, it would be useful to have that put on the record, too.

Mr Irwin, when you gave evidence on 25 January regarding the secondment arrangement, you told us that there was no reference to the Ferguson Marine board. However, Mr Tydeman has told us, in writing, that he made Mr Mackenzie, who was chair of the board at that time—February and March 2022—aware of that arrangement. Again, is Mr Tydeman wrong?