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Thank you very much for that comprehensive summary of the report, which touches on many of the areas that we want to ask you about.

You mentioned in that opening statement—and it is a stand-out conclusion of the report—that NHS Ayrshire and Arran has the highest level of outstanding brokerage of any territorial health board in Scotland. You say in the report that the figure for the audited year 2024-25 was £51.4 million, which represents 4.3 per cent of revenue resource limit.

Can you tell us how that compares with other health boards? Is NHS Ayrshire and Arran a real outlier or are there other health boards that are in a similar position or going in that direction?

In theory, at least, brokerage loans are loans that are expected to be repaid, but when it is projected that NHS Ayrshire and Arran will have a cumulative financial deficit of £112 million, and it has outstanding loans of £129.9 million, is it realistic to expect that any of that money will be paid back? Indeed, would that be the right thing to do?

The other issue that comes into this picture is the requirement on all health boards to find recurring savings of 3 per cent. I have always found it a little incongruous that, in an era in which we are seeing historically high levels of spending in the national health service, we are expecting health boards to make 3 per cent savings. Could you talk us through how that is supposed to work, especially in the context of a health board such as NHS Ayrshire and Arran, which, as we have just discussed, has massive brokerage, a massive projected cumulative financial deficit and so on?

Just for completeness, does the report talk about savings being wrongly classified as recurring when they were non-recurring savings?

That is an issue of transparency for us, but, as you say, it is also an issue for the people who have responsibility for the safe governance and effective leadership of the board.

Thank you very much indeed.

We have another evidence session up and coming on NHS Grampian, which was also the subject of a section 22 report. Before we turn to that, I will take this opportunity to thank Fiona Mitchell-Knight, the Auditor General and Leigh Johnston for the evidence that you have given us on the position of NHS Ayrshire and Arran.

I suppose that, for context, we need to understand the point that you made towards the end, which is that not all the 14 territorial health boards have required brokerage. The question for us as the Public Audit Committee is why some boards have required it and others have not. Maybe there are fundamental issues about the funding formula—who knows? I think that there are some wider points that we need to get a better understanding of.

Thank you very much indeed for what has been a very useful session for us. I will now suspend the meeting while we change witnesses.

I have a question before we leave this area. Auditor General, you have mentioned the KPMG report a couple of times. One of the key messages that the auditor attached to the report is that staffing levels are out of kilter with the number of beds in NHS Grampian. The report goes on to cite different grades. It says, for example, that there has been a 16.4 per cent increase of nursing whole-time-equivalent staff in the past three years, a 17.8 per cent increase of medical and dental WTEs, an 18.2 per cent increase among the administrative staff, and an increase of over 33 per cent when we get to other therapeutic staff. KPMG’s argument is that there are far too many people employed by NHS Grampian and that its cost base is out of line; it says that that is a deficit driver that it would not expect and so on. However, if the narrative is that these are positions that were previously outsourced to agencies at great expense and have now been brought in-house, that might be a good thing. Do you have a view on that?

I am not quite sure that that is what I took from the KPMG report. You have said, and it is in your section 22 report, that NHS Grampian has the lowest bed base per 1,000 population and so on, yet one of the things that is highlighted in the KPMG report is that there has been a further reduction in the number of beds available in NHS Grampian. It also goes on to talk about how artificial intelligence could be brought in to replace some of what it describes as lower grade staff. I am not quite sure whether we would sign up to that, but there are some ideas out there about how things can be streamlined, are there not?.

I guess that there are broader questions here about bed numbers, which is an issue that came up in our discussion about NHS Ayrshire and Arran. Is reducing the number of beds one of the Government’s targets as a means of driving down the cost base in territorial health boards?

Fine—thank you. I will now invite Colin Beattie to put some questions to you.

That is a moot point and a question for our times, is it not?

I now invite the deputy convener to ask some questions.