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Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
That ends this very useful session. I take the opportunity to thank you again, Auditor General, for presenting that evidence and producing the report. I also take the opportunity to thank Thomas Charman and Richard Robinson for their evidence this morning. We need to consider what our next steps are, and we will take a bit of time to look at that.
I will suspend the meeting to allow for a changeover of witnesses.
10:47 Meeting suspended.Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
You have not read all of it. Which bits have you read?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
That is fine. It is just that, in the course of this morning, we may turn to things that the Auditor General said.
Mr Watson, do you want to say anything at the outset?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
Yes, but I do not think that any of us would accept that there was nothing to see here, Mr Watson.
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
That is not how the Auditor General viewed the situation when he gave evidence to us on 8 October, and we can return to that.
One of the things that have been reported is that, under your tenure as the principal and chief executive, there were five different finance directors. Why was that?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
Thank you very much. We have heard quite a lot of useful evidence this morning and I think that you have been given an opportunity to put on the record some things that I know you feel inject some more balance into our committee considerations. As the deputy convener said, we very much appreciate you taking the time to come in and give us the benefit of your experience and your perspective on the Auditor General’s report.
As I said at the outset, in January 2026, I think, we are due to take evidence from some of the people who have taken your previous positions, as well as from the Scottish Funding Council and the wider University of the Highlands and Islands. That will give us an opportunity to put to them some of the things that you have said to us. You may wish to follow that with some interest.
Mr Watson, I think that you agreed to share with us the December 2024 letter. If any of you, on reflection after today, have anything else that you want to supply to us, we are quite happy to accept a note after today’s oral evidence session to help us prepare for the next round of evidence that we will take. Dr Cook, Mr Wishart and Mr Watson, thank you for coming in and for the evidence that you have presented to us this morning.
I move the committee into private session.
12:20 Meeting continued in private until 12:52.Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
I will bring in Joe FitzPatrick in a second, but can I just take you back, Mr Watson, to some of the fundamentals here? When we took evidence from the Auditor General on 8 October, he said:
“I ... cannot recall, from my time in this role and during my career of auditing public bodies in Scotland, an organisation that has not prepared an annual budget.”
In your time—in your career—Mr Watson, have you ever been part of an organisation that has not prepared an annual budget?
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
Thank you for that introduction. I will go straight to the deputy convener to kick off the questioning.
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
Good morning. I welcome everyone to the 32nd meeting in 2025 of the Public Audit Committee.
Under agenda item 1, does the committee agree to take agenda items 4 to 8 in private?
Members indicated agreement.
Public Audit Committee
Meeting date: 3 December 2025
Richard Leonard
Agenda item 2 is consideration of the Auditor General for Scotland’s report, “Financial sustainability and taxes”.
I am pleased to welcome to the committee the Auditor General for Scotland, Stephen Boyle. Alongside the Auditor General, we have Richard Robinson, senior manager, and Thomas Charman, senior auditor, both from Audit Scotland. We have quite a number of questions to put to you this morning on the report, Auditor General, but before we get to those, I invite you to make an opening statement.