Seòmar agus comataidhean

I understand the time pressures, but I have a committee meeting that I need to prepare for, as I got the committee meeting papers at 5 minutes to 8 last night, I think. Extending this session will jeopardise my position as convener of another committee and my ability to speak to my amendments, so I respectfully ask that you reconsider that or shorten the session by a bit.

Before I speak to and move my amendment, and because there are new committee members, I would like to make a declaration of interests in line with those that I have made before, so that people are aware that I am a member of a family farming partnership and the joint owner of a wild fishery. Both roles require the controlling of some species of wildlife, including stoats, weasels, mink, rats, mice, foxes and corvids, which include crows, rooks and jackdaws. I have been controlling and managing wildlife to manage environments for more than 40 years. I use licensed firearms and spring traps.

I make it clear that I do not own any hill ground, but I have been involved for more than 40 years in muirburn and burning to manage grassland and farmland and protect it from invasive species such as gorse and broom. In the past, I have supervised muirburn and have contributed to muirburn consultations and management plans. I hope that what I have said is sufficient for the committee to understand that I have a relevant interest in the matter.

Convener, I will speak only to the amendments in the group that are relevant to me. The reason why I lodged my amendments is to ensure that training courses are relevant and that there is consultation with interested parties and land managers when it comes to setting them up. In my experience in the countryside, I have found that, once courses have been set up, they tend to expand in time. For example, a deer stalking certificate 1 course that could have lasted two days now extends to four days. It concerns me that a whole industry is building up around these courses. I believe that they can be limited in time to make sure that they are short and relevant.

The other thing that I have found is that courses are becoming increasingly expensive. There may be up to eight to 10 people on a course, with each being charged £500 to £600 for it. It can work out as £3,000 a day for one instructor, which seems an extremely high figure. I seek to limit the cost of the courses to ensure that everyone has the opportunity to take them.

I do not propose to speak to the other amendments in the group yet. I will listen to the arguments that are made on them and comment at the end. Thank you for your time, convener.

I move amendment 180.

We, in this room, all recognize that every part of Scotland is different. I am sure that the convener and Colin Smyth would argue that the Borders is the place to be, and Kate Forbes and I might argue that the Highlands are the place to be.

I thank the member for giving way. From the data that she has gathered, what moorland ground-nesting bird is nesting on 15 March?

I am asking about 15 March in the Highlands.

Minister, I am sure that you will accept that things happen at a different pace across Scotland. As a farmer, you will know, for example, that grass will grow quicker in Perthshire than it will in the Highlands. That affects all wildlife, as far as seasons go, because things may take longer when it is colder and darker for longer. That is why I am asking for allowance to be made for geographical variance across Scotland. To treat Scotland as being all the same seems to me to be somewhat strange if we are trying to control management and put it on a level at which we get the best possible outcome for each environment.

I am not seeking a meeting—I seem to be the only member who has not had, or has not been offered, a meeting with you, minister. Will you accept, nevertheless, that there is variance across Scotland and that it would be worth considering geographical variance to take into account latitude and conditions?

With the committee’s indulgence, I will comment briefly on Rachael Hamilton’s amendment 63. The reason for asking for the time period to be extended from five years to 10 years is purely that the period will have a huge effect on whether a business is viable. I do not think that anyone really understands that buying just an Argocat, without a sprayer on the back, is probably going to cost you £35,000. Buying a Land Rover or another vehicle to get round the land that you are managing will add another £30,000. When you add on the costs of the traps and the rest of the equipment that you will need, the cost of going on the training courses and the cost of providing a house for the employee, you are probably looking at an investment—just to start up with one employee—of north of £150,000, and the yearly running costs for these places are exceptionally high.

The point of having a 10-year licence is that it would give some surety and security, most importantly to the people who are employed there. There is a real fear that jobs that are here today may be gone tomorrow, and a five-year licence could bring that about. Everyone knows—I am sure that Ms Forbes knows this—the fragility of the rural countryside and of jobs for gamekeepers on upland estates when it comes to management. Protecting their jobs and giving investors some surety is therefore important, which is why I support the period being changed to 10 years.

I am slightly concerned about Colin Smyth’s amendment 131. He wants every single animal that is killed or taken on the land to which the licence relates to be recorded. We would have long lists of rats and mice and every other species that we could possibly record, and I am not sure what benefit would accrue from that at the end of the day. There might have been a way in which the amendment could be supported if it was targeted at species excluding rats and mice. It might have been important to include animals whose spread we want to keep track of that are being killed. An example is mink, which there is encouragement to remove as they are an invasive species.

I urge the committee to support Rachael Hamilton’s amendment 63 and not to support Colin Smyth’s amendment 131.

I feel forced to move amendment 17, because I have received no reassurances from the Government; nor is it laid down in legislation what the procedure would be for other birds, notwithstanding some words that were given today. I therefore press amendment 17.

I will not move amendment 4 on the basis of my earlier explanation.

Amendment 4 not moved.

I will not move amendment 5 for the reasons that I gave earlier.

Amendment 5 not moved.

Section 2 agreed to.

After section 2